Don Klipstein said:
You sure as hell do; lightning is one source of the stuff!
I meant a layer of air 4 miles thick
doesnt 'flow out of some thunderstorms'
Same amount of NO2 that light has to pass through!
Still aint brown at 1PPM, even thru 4 miles of it!
No, it's your knowledge of chemistry that is mangled.
Bullshit. You dont ever get 'just two NO2 molecules
stuck together more than being a different compound)'
Fantasyland chemistry.
Until you look through a couple miles of it.
It still aint brown even thru a couple of miles of it.
"Brown Cloud" air pollution is nitrogen dioxide or nitrogen dioxide
Wrong.
plus carbon particles fine enough to make things seen through
the cloud look brownish due to scattering preferentially of blue light.
Particles of many kinds, actually. Doesnt have to be carbon.
Its that that produces the spectacular red sunsets with major fires.
One source saying nitrogen dioxide plus fine carbon particles:
http://phoenix.about.com/library/weekly/uc051601a.htm
Its wrong. Basic physics. Steve clearly aint gotta clue and his
'credentials' are complete duds as far as physics is concerned.
Another source saying nitrogen dioxide is
responsible for "brown cloud" urban air pollution:
http://phoenix.about.com/library/weekly/uc051601a.htm
Thats the same one.
Just the first two hits of a Google search of "brown cloud" "nitrogen dioxide"!
Nope, just one actually. And plenty of pig ignorant shit turns up on the web.
A few other hits whose summaries reported by Google
appear to support nitrogen dioxide, whether alone or
with really fine carbon particles, making air look brownish:
We'll see.
The first para of that says
Extremely small particles are the principal cause of the brown cloud.
These tiny particles, too small to be seen without a microscope, are
measured in microns, with one micron equal to about one-seventieth
(1/70) of the diameter of a human hair. Particulate matter less than
2.5 microns, often referred to as PM2.5, is a significant cause of haze.
Each particle, about the size of a single grain of flour, can float in the
atmosphere for days, behaving much like a gas. Over half of the
PM2.5 in Phoenix is caused by the burning of gasoline and diesel fuel
in vehicles (sometimes referred to as on-road mobile sources) and in
off-road mobile sources, such as construction equipment like loaders
and bulldozers, locomotives, lawn mowers, leaf blowers, and other
devices that emit air pollution as they move1. PM2.5 particles containing
carbon, like soot from tail pipes, are particularly effective in reducing
visibility, because they both scatter and absorb light.
Which is exactly what I said, using a lot more words.
Doesnt say that the brown is primarily NOx
Doesnt say that the brown is primarily NOx
Pure political bullshit.
3. Is it a brown cloud day? A brown cloud appears to envelop
the scene but quickly thins out at higher elevations. Look at
the particle and black carbon levels -- they are usually high.
Ozone will be low and relative humidity may vary.
Doesnt say a damned thing about NOx
being the cause of a visible brown haze.
Try again.
Are you calling me a liar?
Nope, you just havent got a clue about the basics.
Those dont rise like say smoke from a fire does.
When it is visible, the finer stuff easily visibly rises!
Not far. THATS what matters.
Looks like you haven't paid attention to a few on the road!
Looks like you aint gotta clue about what's being
discussed, whether that stuff rises that much.
So you say diesel trucks produce smoke other than soot
A properly setup diesel engine does just that. Its only the badly
setup trucks that generate high levels of the jet black soot you
see inside monitors adjacent to the FBT, and as Ken pointed
out, you STILL get that inside monitors, even when there are
bugger all diesel trucks in use at all, let alone many setup
that badly. So it cant be coming from diesel trucks.
Basic logic.
and other than the gray "oil burning" stuff? And what
else has a "gray-transparent" look when seen through
and when finer, has a "diluted-milk-grayish-blue" but
darker when illuminated by sunlight?
What was being discussed was how many diesel trucks produce
much JET BLACK SOOT. You claimed that that somehow ends
up in monitors. You cant explain why you STILL get that jet black
soot in monitors even when there aint no diesel trucks in use at
all, SO IT CANT BE COMING FROM THEM.
Basic logic.
I can make soot fine enough to look bluish when illuminated by a bright
flashlight by running a propane torch with the air intake holes blocked.
Got SFA to do with whether the jet black soot you can see with
badly setup diesel engines is what ends up inside monitors.
I just tried that! Are you going to say that
propane can make ash or tar particles?
Nope. It doesnt produce JET BLACK SOOT normally
either unless you completely stuff up the gas to air mixture.
And that doesnt happen enough for it to be the
source of the jet black soot we see inside monitors.
