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Quasiturbine in « Brash Vehicle Propulsion System ».

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...
On thing is clear anything for the USA is negative towards to compressed
air
as the US corporations are doing other things.

Motorists, however, have come to expect much more from their cars. That's
why some of MDI's critics think that automakers should be focusing not on
air-powered cars but on pneumatic-fuel hybrids. Unlike cars running on
compressed air alone, the greater power available from pneumatic hybrids
would suit full-function, highway-capable vehicles. ...

Congratulations, you've caught up to century-old torpedo propulsion.
They used it because there's no air for combustion underwater, and
torps are too inaccurate to need great range. This was the best:
http://www.combinedfleet.com/torps.htm
<<<<<<

Do you have point here? MDI are looking at it and heating the air entering
the engines.
The spare-no-expense submarines themselves
ran on batteries submerged and Diesels on the
surface.

Also, because in that application the batteries of the time held more energy
than a compressed air motor system - which is only an energy carrier. The
air motors of the time were not that efficient to what is available today.
Things do move on. The bubbles released from a sub would give it away, which
defeats the object of a stealth craft
I work in R&D on alternative energy projects,
and also tinker with them at home, thus my
well-developed BS filter to avoid loser projects
and scatterbrained inventors. I'm only interested
if they focus on analyzing and solving the remaining
problems

In short you can't think out of the box, tinkering with existing technology.
Big corporations have learned through
long and expensive experience
what sells and what doesn't,

Corporations? You are having a laugh of course. You are trying to say they
are innovative? They decide what sells and does not. Anyone with half a
brain can see that the appalling piston IC engine should have been phased
out 60 years ago - 80% of the energy in the tank is wasted. The corporation
have only moved forward when forced to thinking only of their bottom lines.
Recall GM bought up electric zero pollution at burn tramways in US cities
and closed them down.

The forthcoming Chevy Volt does 50mpg running on the IC genny alone - not
batteries. That is an amazing increase in mpg by about 100%. Yet what they
are doing was well known over 100 years ago. It was also well known 30-40
years ago. A specifically designed IC genny tuned to run to optimum
efficiency with a constant speed, feeding an electric motor powering the
wheels. The inefficient power sapping, heavy, space consuming auto
transmission is then gone. All this was known decades ago as motors, IC and
electric, and gennies became more efficient and smaller.

Experimenters had tried it and had good results in mpg. It is just basic
R&D matching the engine to the genny to the electric motor to the car body
weight. Some called it an electric transmission before the word hybrid was
used. Using electric motors give a superb seamless ride. Yet, knowing all
this the corporations have only just responded using this simple well known
and proven technology.
Very few people will put up with any
significant inconvenience to save
energy,

That is true. Energy can be saved with no inconvenience.

When I hear someone lauding corporations I detect BS and that their wages
come from them. 90 years ago there was an abundance of small auto makers all
over the world who made great technological leaps to improve and get their
products sold. Little has progressed since WW2. Toyota, a corporation, came
up with the Prius and took world-wide castigation by the Ludites - which is
now a great success.

The world progressed by individual men or small groups of them, not by money
obsessed corporations.
 
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...
The world progressed by individual men or small groups of them, not by
money
obsessed corporations.

Another hate-blinded conspiracy theorist?
<<<<<

Look at the record of corporations. You are naive.

Do you get your wages from one of them?
 
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Basically people are people regardless of where they work, you are
guilty of profiling if you pretend otherwise, and a naive fool if you
think the size of an organization is any indication of its ethics.
<<<<<

I have done R&D for the EU working for a small company. Also working for a
corporation. Also for a smallish US company developing its own products.
The best and most innovative and receptive to new ideas were the small
companies. They appreciate those who thought out of the box.

Size matters as the company culture is very different.
 
The best and most innovative and receptive to new ideas were the small
companies. They appreciate those who thought out of the box.

Sure, but you're so far out of the box you'd need a Stargate if you
wanted to see it.

Wayne
 
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...
I have done R&D for the EU working for a small company. Also working for a
corporation. Also for a smallish US company developing its own products.
The best and most innovative and receptive to new ideas were the small
companies. They appreciate those who thought out of the box.

Size matters as the company culture is very different.

Some engineers make better managers than others. I think they are the
best indicator of how large vs innovative a company can become, though
you can't tell when you interview there. The corporate culture shifts
when they hit their limit and step aside. Here's one who didn't when
he should have and almost destroyed the company.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glenn_L._Martin

Like computers the early aviation industry attracted a number of
creative, adventuresome individualists who found themselves running
huge corporations. Some of their bios are good reading, especially
Eddie Rickenbacker's and Merian C. Cooper's (King Kong, Operations
officer for the Flying Tigers in China)

The minimum sized team of the RIGHT people seems to work best, at
least at first, but some larger companies form "Skunk Works" or tiger
teams and give them enough freedom to be effective, BTDT. Others could
kill anything with bureaucracy, I've quit them.

The FAA was interesting, some free-swinging pilot/cowboy types who had
learned to live within (or play) the system.

This is one of the cleverest innovators I've worked for, and see where
he went:
http://www.appletell.com/apple/comment/segway-cto-becomes-apple-lead-designer/
<<<<

In WW2 the British were ahead of all in the techno war. They were the
innovators. The US were good engineers, the DUCK was an example - a 2.5
truck converted to an amphibious landing craft. Cheap and effective using a
lot of stock parts. The Higgins Boat another.

The great innovations of the British were done with a few people. They were
motivated and given a free line. Some had small budgets as well. Whittle
and his jet engine - who constantly fought beaurocracy to get the jet engine
a reality. If they had taken him seriously 5 years earlier many say WW2 may
not have happened as the British would have had fleets of operational jets
in 1939, that would have wiped out the Luftwaffe, deterring the Germans. The
anti-submarine radar controlled Leigh Light was mainly down to one man's
perseverance. The radar advances, again a few motivated people working
together. Also the same with the first electronic computers, Colossus - only
a handful of people. The smaller British MAUD team achieved so much more
than the large US atom bomb team - MAUD's design was the one that went ahead
it was so advanced.
 
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Taking Whittle seriously earlier could have been insufficient. The jet
also depended on new alloys:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nimonic
<<<<<<

The development of the alloys was spurred by the Jet engine. That would have
been done earlier.

The German Junkers jet was a poor jet and lasted a short time. It was
incomplete because the Germans did not have specialist metals because the
Royal Navy blockaded Germany.
 
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GillesQT said:
University of Connecticut -
Quasiturbine in « Brash Vehicle Propulsion System ».
Photo and video:
http://www.brashengines.com/FAQ.html
http://www.youtube.com/brashengines
A project supported by the US Department of Transportation
(John Volpe National Transportation Systems Center)
exploring the use of BRASHT technology for large vehicles, such as mass
transit vehicles.

The cyclone steam engine looks promising.
http://engineeringtv.com/video/Cyclone-Waste-Heat-Engine

No oil lubrication, Simple, No transmission, No management systems, No
starter motor. External combustion. Higher HP. Cheaper to run than IC
engines. Cheap to service. Eco being external combustion. Can use any fuel.
Great cogen use as well as auto. With congen the waste condensing heat can
be fanned into a home. Can be powered by a solar concentrator panel. Won
an award.

http://www.cyclonepower.com
 
V

vaughn

Jim Wilkins said:
The Titanic had an energy-recovering turbine that ran on the nearly
atmospheric pressure exhaust steam of the two main triple-expansion
engines and generated about as much power as one of them.
http://www.titanic-titanic.com/titanic_engine_room.shtml
Steam expanded in the turbine from 9 PSI (gage?) to almost a vacuum in
the condenser, the exact value depending on ocean water temperature.
Other ships had them too but Titanic has more references.

Actually, virtually all steam engines have that feature, but it is unusual for
it to be a separate turbine. If you notice, a steam turbine is wedge shaped.
The first stages are relatively tiny, the last stages are relatively huge, yet
the turbine is typically designed so that each stage produces about the same HP
as the steam expands. The last stage exhausts into the vacuum of the condenser.
That vacuum improves the efficiency of the steam (Rankine) cycle far more than
intuition would suggest. The condenser saves the boiler feed water for reuse,
but this increase in efficiency is just as important.

In the case of triple expansion engines, the low pressure piston is many times
larger than the high pressure piston, yet probably produces about the same HP.
The LP stage is probably designed to exhaust into a vacuum, which greatly
increases the efficiency of the system.

For the curious: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rankine_cycle

Vaughn
 
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< snip >

The opening post had the compact and efficient Quasiturbine running on
steam. What its efficiency is on steam is I don't know. But the engine is
rotary and small. The cyclone part of this engine coupled to a Quasiturbine
looks interesting. If a good efficient match then maybe something that is
viable and marketable soon could be produced.
 
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News said:
< snip >

The opening post had the compact and efficient Quasiturbine running on
steam. What its efficiency is on steam is I don't know. But the engine is
rotary and small. The cyclone part of this engine coupled to a
Quasiturbine looks interesting. If a good efficient match then maybe
something that is viable and marketable soon could be produced.

Would having these small Quasiturbine engines in series, the steam output of
one fed into another, increase efficiency?

They are very small which is great advantage in packaging, as well as no
pistons giving a smoother operation.
 
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...
Would having these small Quasiturbine engines
in series, the steam output of
one fed into another, increase efficiency?

They are very small which is great advantage in packaging, as well as no
pistons giving a smoother operation.

There is no way I could tell without measuring the performance of a
working model, I'm a lab tech not a computational fluid dynamicist,
Jim.

This is about as far as my knowledge of steam efficiency goes:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indicator_diagram
<<<<<

The Quasiturbine web site is down. I did a Google and one site said you
could have two on the same shaft 45 degrees apart using steam.

But, the efficiency figures I am not aware of. The design lends it to
superior efficiency, but how greater than what we have is another matter.
The Qusiturbine would need more R&D and the cyclone part as well then the
coupling of them together. It should make a smallish package for a vehicle.

http://www.internationalsteam.co.uk/trains/newsteam/modern31.htm

They go on about eliminating a steam boiler and flash steam injection.

This is interesting:
http://www.damninteresting.com/the-six-stroke-engine
 
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I have never seen a useful discussion of the real problems of machine
design in a press release. The hair-pullers are lubrication,
vibration, fatigue, strength and temperature resistance, etc, not the
Rube-Goldberg cleverness of what we call monkey motion that's used to
appeal to the public to get them to invest.

You want a really compact piston engine?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swashplate_engine
It looks great, been around a long time, in practice the main
successful use is hydrostatic lawn tractors.

Some of those very clever steam power ideas go all the way back to
Oliver Evans in 1800. He quickly found that the machining and
metallurgy of the time were wholly inadequate and they still control
the pace of a lot of development. Read the article on the
micromachined silicon carbide turbine, for instance.

A flash boiler that burns free bio waste isn't so economical if it has
to be made out of this stuff to handle the temperature and pressure:
http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/general-archive/price-inconel-718-a-79792/
Those are old prices. A few years ago I was quoted $50/Lb for Inconel
tube, 5 Lbs would buy a gas engine and a lot of fuel. I used 316L
stainless instead, still not cheap new but I found some scrap for $1/
lb.
<<<<

Swashplates are used with some Stirling engines. The make a compact design
but ten Revetec, which is a real thing using a lobe instead of a crack is
very compact and should be cheaper to run. In effect it is a doubled ended
piston with a lobe in the centre. The lobes can be shaped have to increase
the torque and eliminate a transmission using a radial design - pistons
around the lobe as in aero engines.
http://www.revetec.com/development.htm
http://www.revetec.com/home.html

They have signed an agreement to develop a cogen unit for as German company
using the design. And also some R&D with the Chinese. If these are sold on
the market then this may make its way to autos - it has to. For cogen I
would like the steam Cyclone/Quasiturbine, as the condenser can be used to
fan heat into a house.
 
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That scam has been around for how long now? Yes, it does "work" if by
that you mean 'runs'. Produce useable power and good fuel economy it
doesn't...unless it has been greatly improved since I last saw a video
of it in use on a chainsaw. At that time I could have cut the same
wood with a dull handsaw faster.

No, I am not going to try to download another idiot video on dial-up.

Harry K

Been around since the 70s I know of.
<<<<<

The Quasiturbine? No. Much later. It is getting attention because of
energy, emission, etc.
 
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...For cogen I
would like the steam Cyclone/Quasiturbine, as the condenser can be used to
fan heat into a house.

Are you prepared to maintain and repair it? Ever rebuild a carburetor,
starter or wiper motor? If not then experimental alternate energy will
be a money pit for you.
<<<<<

I am talking about a production model.
 
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Are you prepared to maintain and repair it? Ever rebuild a carburetor,
starter or wiper motor? If not then experimental alternate energy will
be a money pit for you.
<<<<<

I am talking about a production model.

I have had to make repair parts for production models of my chainsaw,
string trimmer, Sears lawn tractor, Ford truck, Maytag washer, etc
when the manufacturer no longer supports them, like after ten years.
Earlier this week I was machining little brass carburetor parts I
couldn't buy, to replace broken plastic ones. Here's a steering sector
gear Sears no longer sells:
http://picasaweb.google.com/KB1DAL/HomeMadeMachines#5285710360947850418
<<<<<

My point is that the cyclone/Quasiturbine offers a simple low part numbers,
low maintenance, small packed, efficient unit. Marketed properly it would
need an annual service like a gas furnace. It looks OK for vehicle usage as
well.
 
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vaughn

Jim Wilkins said:
I have had to make repair parts for production models of my chainsaw,
string trimmer, Sears lawn tractor, Ford truck, Maytag washer, etc
when the manufacturer no longer supports them, like after ten years.
Earlier this week I was machining little brass carburetor parts I
couldn't buy, to replace broken plastic ones. Here's a steering sector
gear Sears no longer sells:
http://picasaweb.google.com/KB1DAL/HomeMadeMachines#5285710360947850418

I know you can't see it, but I am holding up my coffee cup in salute to you!
Actually, our washing machine, our drier, and our 'frig are all well over 10
years old and have all been home repaired multiple times (much to my wife's
disgust, she wants new) Fortunately for us, the things that go bad (so far) are
common parts that are marketed by third parties.

Vaughn
 
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vaughn

News said:
My point is that the cyclone/Quasiturbine offers...
low maintenance

You can't know that. The only quasiturbine you can buy is a lab bench demo unit
which does not ever appear to have a lube system.

, small packed, efficient unit

You can't know that. The IC version is still in the future. If you make it
external combustion, then size and complexity of the entire system increases
dramatically. If you combine it with some other turbine as you are suggesting,
then size, complexity, weight, & cost all increase to a whole new level.

As for efficiency, as an IC engine the Quasiturbine would really be much the
same as a Wankel http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wankel_engine , with many of the
same problems. These will include the odd-shaped combustion chamber, sealing,
and lubrication. There is a reason why the Wankel remains a relative rarity on
the world's roadways even after 50 years of development. In efficiency, it has
never matched the piston engine.


..> Marketed properly it would need an annual service like a gas furnace.

Yet again, you can't know the maintenance requirements of a machine that has no
track record.

It looks OK for vehicle usage as well.

In all these years, how many folks have even tried? Why not?

Vaughn
 
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vaughn

Jim Wilkins said:
but possibly the most reliable, well built piece of outdoor equipment I have
is a 1955-ish motorized
reel lawnmower.

That reminds me of my ancient Briggs-powered edger of indeterminate age &
ancestry. When the 2 HP flathead engine stops smoking, you know it is time to
add oil, but it always starts and it keeps right on edging. I think I am the
only guy in the neighborhood that still uses a push-type edger. Why change
something that works?

Vaughn
 
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