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Researchers create laser light interconnects on silicon

[email protected] schreef:


Well, I was not insulting anyone.
You would not happen to be a Muslim fundamentalist now would you?
They get insulted by a self-inflicting reflective suicide-insult
mechanism.
like this:
http://groups.google.com/group/us.p...c2926c62b6f/98d4e474dd67e280#98d4e474dd67e280
'Moslems Threaten to Massacre Christians Over Claim of Islamic
Violence'

LOL

<thumbs up>Hey man, good point once in a while!</thumbs up> Sure I
want to have nothing in common with Muslim fundamentalists, so much so
that I would not even share the planet with them if only there was any
way to do so other than suicide ;-)

NNN
 
J

John Larkin

Good grief, this was the #1 headline article on the front page of
today's SF Chronicle.

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2006/09/19/MNGHKL89HG1.DTL&type=business


The "science" writers of the world seem to be copying and embellishing
one another's articles; they keep gatting more absurd.

Nobody has mentioned about the size of optical waveguides, cutoff
wavelengths and stuff. Copper and aluminum conductors are already down
to 50 nm width; the light from these lasers is, what, 1300 nm?

John
 
P

Phil Hobbs

John said:
Good grief, this was the #1 headline article on the front page of
today's SF Chronicle.

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2006/09/19/MNGHKL89HG1.DTL&type=business


The "science" writers of the world seem to be copying and embellishing
one another's articles; they keep gatting more absurd.

Nobody has mentioned about the size of optical waveguides, cutoff
wavelengths and stuff. Copper and aluminum conductors are already down
to 50 nm width; the light from these lasers is, what, 1300 nm?

John

Optics is perhaps practical for long wires (1 cm or longer). Those
connections have to be made at the top metal levels, which are typically
2 to 5 um pitch. Wiring density with optics is comparable or slightly
better, because you don't need differential signalling.

Cheers,

Phil Hobbs
 
D

Del Cecchi

Phil said:
John Bowers of UCSB is a collaborator of mine...we're on the Intra-Chip
Optical Networks (ICON) team in the DARPA UNIQ program. He's a very
smart guy who knows his stuff, and this is a pretty nice piece of work.
However, he's not the one doing all the heavy breathing--it looks like
the Intel hype machine is what's behind that. (Those Intel hype guys
are _good_--better than the technology people, that's for sure.)

The gee-whiz terabit numbers are assuming things like 40 Gb/s per
wavelength, with 50 wavelengths per line, which isn't impossible at all.
The idea is that one 'wire' can pass many full-speed logic signals
simultaneously, which is a big win. You don't need terahertz logic
speeds to do this, which is a good thing since we're not going to have
terahertz logic speeds, ever.

You need a transistor f_max at least 10 times the logic speed, and you
can't make transistors with f_max of 20 THz. This is because the
maximum frequency that signals can propagate in a semiconductor is
proportional to the square root of the carrier density. The same is
true in plasmas, which is why this limit is called the 'plasma
frequency.' You can't dope semiconductors enough to get the plasma
frequency higher than 10-30 THz, so you can't make 20 THz transistors,
so you can't make 2 THz logic out of transistors. Not to mention that
at that speed, the region of the chip you can keep synchronous is about
30 microns square, on optimistic assumptions.

It's very helpful to have optical gain in all-photonic ICs, and these
InP-based devices may turn out to be an important part of the tool kit.
Wire is so much easier to make than these optical gizmos that we have
to have a really amazing advantage in real computer performance before
the chip guys will even talk to us. (I'd feel the same in their shoes.)
Fortunately it looks like we can do that.

Cheers,

Phil Hobbs
So you can do dwdm or at least WDM using a single laser? Or is it more
LED? How is the cavity for the laser formed? VCSEL?
 
P

Phil Hobbs

Del said:
So you can do dwdm or at least WDM using a single laser? Or is it more
LED? How is the cavity for the laser formed? VCSEL?

No, you use add-drop couplers made from resonant rings coupled to the Si
waveguides. You can make modulators that way too--you tune the ring
back and forth across the laser line.

Cheers,

Phil Hobbs
 
D

Dirk Bruere at NeoPax

John said:
There have been many: fiber optics, CDs and DVDs, CCDs and thermal
imagers, semiconductor lasers, laser printers, high-efficiency LEDs
from infrared to ultraviolet. But Intel hypes every obscure gadget as
the Next Big Thing, like their Raman "on-chip silicon laser" that
needs a table-sized external optical pump.

Pasting compound-semi lasers on top of silicon chips is interesting,
worthy of a journal article, but everybody is already declaring it to
be a miracle that will change the world. Unlikely.

I'm referring to the hype about how 'optical computers' will be 1000x as
powerful using 'this new technology' BS.
 
J

John Larkin

I'm referring to the hype about how 'optical computers' will be 1000x as
powerful using 'this new technology' BS.


"If they can pull it off, it will definitely make circuits work
faster," Hutcheson said. "It'll make your PC work faster. You can edit
movies. Photoshop will work much easier."

- San Francisco Chronicle

John
 
D

Dirk Bruere at NeoPax

John said:
"If they can pull it off, it will definitely make circuits work
faster," Hutcheson said. "It'll make your PC work faster. You can edit
movies. Photoshop will work much easier."

- San Francisco Chronicle

But it won't make it work faster than simply shrinking size to the next
gen semi process.
 
J

John Larkin

Optics is perhaps practical for long wires (1 cm or longer). Those
connections have to be made at the top metal levels, which are typically
2 to 5 um pitch. Wiring density with optics is comparable or slightly
better, because you don't need differential signalling.

Cheers,

Phil Hobbs

Do you think that on-chip optical links will ever make sense? A laser
and a photoreceiver seem like a lot of overhead to move signals a cm
or so.

Fast serial inter-chip links seem a little more practical, but they
will still need a fast, low-noise receiver and connectors. Equalized
electrical connections keep getting better... somebody just
demonstrated a 10 GBPS link that works over a couple hundred feet of
unshielded CAT6.

Fiber is great over distances where electrical losses get untenable...
hundreds of meters or hundreds of km.

John
 
G

George Macdonald

Your remarks, you are proven wrong, and do not admit it.

For >30 years I've been "proven" wrong. There's a difference between proof
of concept and a viable economic, marketable solution... which seems to get
lost on you.
Time to killfile your drivel.

Go ahead - I'll be delighted to not have your mindless ravings to deal
with.
 
S

Spehro Pefhany

"If they can pull it off, it will definitely make circuits work
faster," Hutcheson said. "It'll make your PC work faster. You can edit
movies. Photoshop will work much easier."

- San Francisco Chronicle

John

With imagination like that, they could be running a major software
company.


Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
 
P

Phil Hobbs

John said:
Do you think that on-chip optical links will ever make sense? A laser
and a photoreceiver seem like a lot of overhead to move signals a cm
or so.

Fast serial inter-chip links seem a little more practical, but they
will still need a fast, low-noise receiver and connectors. Equalized
electrical connections keep getting better... somebody just
demonstrated a 10 GBPS link that works over a couple hundred feet of
unshielded CAT6.

Fiber is great over distances where electrical losses get untenable...
hundreds of meters or hundreds of km.

I think that optics will continue to move in from the long-distance end
toward shorter and shorter links, but how far it gets is anybody's
guess. You're right that the wire guys are smart, and that wire can
still be improved quite a bit. (In fact one of the main problems I see
is that the board-to-board stuff is all 850 nm multimode, whereas the
on-chip stuff is shaping up to be 1.55 um single mode, polarization
preserving, for good reasons of material absorption and
manufacturability in both cases. In reality the gazinta has to connect
with the gazouta.)

The difficulty with equalizing electrical links--pre-emphasis,
decision-feedback equalization, etc.--is that it eats power. Since the
wire attenuation is what it is, that 10 Gb/s Cat6 link has to work by
beating the daylights out of the near end so that something vaguely
recognizable can come out of the DFE at the other end. You can't do
that on chip, because you need thousands of those links (just counting
the long ones), and want to keep the interconnect power below, say, 30W.
Putting a lot of EQ on also requires higher supply voltages.

Wire has some clear limits. The capacitance of a copper wire is going
to be 2 pF/cm forever and ever, and you aren't going to improve the
conductivity of copper either. Damascene processes (where the copper
sits in a liner of refractory metal) make this worse by reducing the
cross sectional area of Cu. You probably can't make reliable electrical
links with less than 200 mV of differential swing. That means that wire
bottoms out in the 1 pJ/bit range, whereas optics can potentially get
below 50 fJ/bit. We think that the crossover comes around the 32-nm node.

If you have the chance, take a look at the current ITRS technology
roadmap--it has charts of the technologies required for each node, and
the boxes are colour-coded green, yellow, or red. The interconnection
section of the 32-nm node is solid red, meaning that nobody has a clue
how to do it, despite having beaten on the wiring problem for decades.
That means that optics is a good contender to be the long-wire
interconnection solution for 32-nm and 22-nm.

As you say, it won't happen with garden variety optical links--which is
why it's a fun area to work in.

Cheers,

Phil Hobbs
 
J

John Larkin

With imagination like that, they could be running a major software
company.


Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany

The irony, one of many, is that increased compute power has almost
always made computers less reliable and harder to use.

John
 
M

Michael A. Terrell

Trent said:
*giggle*

Angels? Do you believe in the Tooth Fairy and Easter Bunny too?


I don't believe in usenet trolls, but there you are.


--
Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
prove it.
Member of DAV #85.

Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida
 
M

Michael A. Terrell

John said:
The irony, one of many, is that increased compute power has almost
always made computers less reliable and harder to use.

John

Like yesterday's foxtrot cartoon. The kid is creating a website, and
he's bragging about everything he is using to create it. His sister
asked, But what will it look like? He has no idea. I think we've found
the person responsible for creating all those useless websites for
semiconductor manufacturers.


--
Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
prove it.
Member of DAV #85.

Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida
 
T

Trent

With quite a bit of room to spare, I might add.
I don't believe in usenet trolls, but there you are.

How about the Great Pumpkin? Do you think Linus will ever give up his
annual foray into the pumpkin patch, or is he doomed to a lifetime of
heartbreak and disappointment? EMWTK.
 
M

Michael A. Terrell

Trent said:
With quite a bit of room to spare, I might add.


How about the Great Pumpkin? Do you think Linus will ever give up his
annual foray into the pumpkin patch, or is he doomed to a lifetime of
heartbreak and disappointment? EMWTK.


Ask Eeyore. He's the expert on cartoon characters.


--
Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
prove it.
Member of DAV #85.

Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida
 
R

redbelly

John said:
Yup, but you could already epoxy and wire-bond a
compound-semiconductor laser on top of a silicon chip. I don't see a
breakthrough here. Still no silicon laser, still no bulk deposition of
non-silicon lasers on silicon.



Lots of people have developed SiO2 and polymer and PLZT optical
waveguides on silicon, for 10 years at least, and a couple of them
have even managed to stay in business. Nothing new here, either.


John

This isn't just waveguides on a chip, they've also added a light source
right on the chip. That part is different. Most light-emitters are
incompatible with silicon.

Mark
 
J

John Larkin

This isn't just waveguides on a chip, they've also added a light source
right on the chip. That part is different. Most light-emitters are
incompatible with silicon.

Mark

They glued individual compound-semiconductor lasers on top of a
silicon chip. Cute, but it hardly deserves front-page headlines. And
all of the press articles I've seen so far have been loaded with
technical inaccuracies and absurd projections. Intel has a fondness
for this sort of thing, and "science writers" rarely know anything
about what they are writing about.

John
 
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