Maker Pro
Maker Pro

How not to wire up an electric grill

G

gearhead

I can't see movies on this PC. Tried to install VLC player but it only
shows a black screen :-(
German Ensign sitting in the command room of a German Coast Guard
station.
Scratchy voice with a British accent comes over the radio:
"Mayday! Mayday! We are sinking! We are sinking!"
German guy pushes the send button on the microphone and says,
"Hello, zis iss ze German Coast Gahd.
Vaht ah you sinking about?"
 
R

Robert Latest

Joerg said:
Hello Folks,

This was posted in a German NG. Now don't do that!

http://www.linuxno.de/_data/gallery/nwl7/_medium_DSCN7823.JPG


Actually I don't think that's very dangerous. It would be dangerous if, in
the case of the power strip getting submerged, a substantial portion of the
current went through the guys' bodies but I can't see how that would happen.

Same with the old "hairdryer in bathtub" situation. What IS dangerous is
holding the dryer (or any other unsealed, mains-powered device) with wet
hands while the rest of the body is well-grounded (as it is when sitting in
the tub). What ISN'T dangerous, IMO, is to drop the plugged-in dryer into
the tub while someone is sitting in it (but not on the sink or other
grounded metal parts), especially if a FI fuse is fitted.

I couldn't bring myself to try it out to freak out the wife though (she's
convinced that 230V can arc about half a meter between blow dryers and
water), but I'm sure the biggest danger is that of an immediate divorce.

robert
 
J

John Devereux

Robert Latest said:
Actually I don't think that's very dangerous. It would be dangerous if, in
the case of the power strip getting submerged, a substantial portion of the
current went through the guys' bodies but I can't see how that would happen.

Same with the old "hairdryer in bathtub" situation. What IS dangerous is
holding the dryer (or any other unsealed, mains-powered device) with wet
hands while the rest of the body is well-grounded (as it is when sitting in
the tub). What ISN'T dangerous, IMO, is to drop the plugged-in dryer into
the tub while someone is sitting in it (but not on the sink or other
grounded metal parts), especially if a FI fuse is fitted.

I couldn't bring myself to try it out to freak out the wife though (she's
convinced that 230V can arc about half a meter between blow dryers and
water), but I'm sure the biggest danger is that of an immediate divorce.

You are probably right - but perhaps the human body is a better
conductor than bath or pool water (being full of salty fluids). So the
current might take a short cut!
 
R

Rich Webb

John said:
You are probably right - but perhaps the human body is a better
conductor than bath or pool water (being full of salty fluids). So the
current might take a short cut!

As I understand it, it's not a case of a short cut but that the current
flows through all available paths and a person in the bath or pool would
be part of, and well coupled to, a non-trivial subset of "all paths."
 
R

Robert Latest

Rich said:
As I understand it, it's not a case of a short cut but that the current
flows through all available paths and a person in the bath or pool would
be part of, and well coupled to, a non-trivial subset of "all paths."

Not quite. Current flows where the electrical field tells it to flow. Two
contacts simultaneously dropped into the water will develop a dipole field
which decays as s^-3 over the distance. If only the "hot" wire gets wet and
the path to ground goes through the body, that's a different matter.

Let's assume an all-metal, grounded bathtub and a standard 20mA FI switch.
The person sits in one end of the tub and a single wire, connected to "hot",
is dipped into the water near the other end. Even if we assume the human
body to be highly conductive it's not going to be as conductive as the tub,
so the current will distribute in all directions and only a small fraction
will go though the terrified would-be victim's body. He probably wouldn't
even feel a shock before the FI cuts off.

With the electric BBQ -- if the power strip goes under, there will be
considerable current between adjacing contacts, but not though the
inhabitants of the pool, who are several feet from the strip.

Would I try this myself? Hell no.

robert
 
D

Dirk Bruere at NeoPax

Robert said:
Not quite. Current flows where the electrical field tells it to flow. Two
contacts simultaneously dropped into the water will develop a dipole field
which decays as s^-3 over the distance. If only the "hot" wire gets wet and
the path to ground goes through the body, that's a different matter.

Let's assume an all-metal, grounded bathtub and a standard 20mA FI switch.
The person sits in one end of the tub and a single wire, connected to "hot",
is dipped into the water near the other end. Even if we assume the human
body to be highly conductive it's not going to be as conductive as the tub,
so the current will distribute in all directions and only a small fraction
will go though the terrified would-be victim's body. He probably wouldn't
even feel a shock before the FI cuts off.

With the electric BBQ -- if the power strip goes under, there will be
considerable current between adjacing contacts, but not though the
inhabitants of the pool, who are several feet from the strip.

Would I try this myself? Hell no.

robert

Mythbusters did a prog on this IIRC.
Concluded that in a bathtub it would probably kill
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MythBusters_(season_2)#Appliances_in_the_Bath
 
J

Joerg

gearhead said:
German Ensign sitting in the command room of a German Coast Guard
station.
Scratchy voice with a British accent comes over the radio:
"Mayday! Mayday! We are sinking! We are sinking!"
German guy pushes the send button on the microphone and says,
"Hello, zis iss ze German Coast Gahd.
Vaht ah you sinking about?"


ROFL!
 
J

Joerg

John said:
You are probably right - but perhaps the human body is a better
conductor than bath or pool water (being full of salty fluids). So the
current might take a short cut!

Well, they are raising their conductivity as evidenced by the brewsky on
the shelf ...
 
J

Joerg

Robert said:
Not quite. Current flows where the electrical field tells it to flow. Two
contacts simultaneously dropped into the water will develop a dipole field
which decays as s^-3 over the distance. If only the "hot" wire gets wet and
the path to ground goes through the body, that's a different matter.

Let's assume an all-metal, grounded bathtub and a standard 20mA FI switch.
The person sits in one end of the tub and a single wire, connected to "hot",
is dipped into the water near the other end. Even if we assume the human
body to be highly conductive it's not going to be as conductive as the tub,
so the current will distribute in all directions and only a small fraction
will go though the terrified would-be victim's body. He probably wouldn't
even feel a shock before the FI cuts off.

If there is a GFCI. And if the GFCI works. Older houses like ours
generally do not feature such devices.
 
Z

z

With the electric BBQ -- if the power strip goes under, there will be
considerable current between adjacing contacts, but not though the
inhabitants of the pool, who are several feet from the strip.

Yeah, it'll probably just go flash, boom, darkness as fuse blows.
Would I try this myself? Hell no.

me neither. Hey mikey, c'mere...
 
M

mpm

I can't see movies on this PC. Tried to install VLC player but it only
shows a black screen :-(


I agree.
QuikTime sucks completely.
---and I avoid it completely.

If someone insists on using it, they lose me as a potential viewer.
Plain and simple.
-mpm
 
J

Joerg

mpm said:
I agree.
QuikTime sucks completely.
---and I avoid it completely.

If someone insists on using it, they lose me as a potential viewer.
Plain and simple.

However, my VLC doesn't show any other video clips either. Someone told
me you need to have flash installed. Of course, that begs the question
what VLC is good for then if the whole purpose was to avoid flash.
 
C

Corbomite Carrie

Hello Folks,

This was posted in a German NG. Now don't do that!

http://www.linuxno.de/_data/gallery/nwl7/_medium_DSCN7823.JPG


I'll bet it is NOT plugged in, and that the photo is a hoax.

Aside from that, the folks in the water are safe. The guy that would
handle the grill is taking the chance, and from all appearances, it is
euro power, so 240V!

ZZZZZZZZZZAP! Blow a fuse pretty quick when all those outlets take on
water between their conductors. UNLESS they are all sealed, except for
the one is use. Still, not a good idea.
 
C

Corbomite Carrie

I agree.
QuikTime sucks completely.
---and I avoid it completely.

Yeah, but we all know that you're an idiot.
If someone insists on using it, they lose me as a potential viewer.
Plain and simple.

Yet another proof of that contention.

It's just a fucking player, dipshit.
 
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