Adding a third keypad to a Caddx NX-8, wiring help requested!

[Robert L Bass]

... this is what I say: Solid wire is better at higher

frequencies and for back bone applications.

That is utter nonsense. There is no difference in the capability
of stranded or solid conductors to carry higher frequency
signals. Furthermore, nothing you're likely to use in an alarm
system data loop involves high frequency data.

Stranded is more flexible and better for patch cords...

Try not to confuse yourself. We're not talking about patch
cords.

its use should be kept to a minimum in comm circuits
because of its greater attenuation characteristics.

That's just more nonsense.

Have a nice day

I did. This morning I went to look at property on the bay front
and another place in Itaigara, had lunch at a seaside cafe and
spent the rest of the day with friends and family enjoying the
beautiful Bahian weather.

Regards,
Robert L Bass
www.BassBurglarAlarms.com

 

[Robert L Bass]

And neither did I. I never said "electrons spin better"...try again foam
duck!

Can un-twisted wire be used?

That depends on the application. For most alarm system keypads
the answer is yes.

Some customers have successfully used un-twisted
wire at short distances. NVT does not recommend
it due to its interference susceptibility.

Try to stay on the subject. NVT doesn't make alarm keypads, let
alone specify cabling for them.

The point is (and always was), that twisted wire provides better
resistance to interference.

That was not the original question.

I have personally witnessed at least 10 keypads
that would do very strange things when using
solid wire.
Bullshit!

Things that can't be caused by "bad connections"
as you try to spin it.

There's no spinning involved here. You simply fabricated 10
events to support a ridiculous theory.

Plus, you are lying when you say ITI engineers
never said that. I was there, you were not.

In your mind, perhaps you were. Reality is you made the story
up. It sounds as though you've been taking debating lessons from
Olson. Have you tried snap-rolling a 737 lately?

(Also, the president of ITI and VP of Dealer Sales
were there...didn't see you!)

Uh-huh, standing right next to Elvis.

...you had no way of being there.

Having never attended a fantasy meeting, I wouldn't know.

 

[Robert L Bass]

Stranded wire is far less apt to act as an antenna source.

Bullshit!

It's why they use 32 gauge stranded wire in those
security window screens (in case you didn't know).

Wrong. Stranded wire is less apt to break from repeated flexing.
That is the ONLY reason it's used in alarm screens (which are not
the same thing as "security screens" by the way.

ITI may (and I say "may") suggest using stranded
wire in their systems, I don't know...

A few manufacturers' manuals suggest stranded wire. Most specify
only the gauge. In no case is it due to a higher or lower
propensity to act as an antenna.

We use DSC and Ademco products...

There's that "we" again. But you are not an installer. You're
just a counter clerk. You have no experience installing anything.
That's why you post idiotic advice to overload output circuits
and "warnings" of the supposed danger using a paddle bit. Anyone
who has ever installed for a living would know you're totally
FOS.

 

[Robert L Bass]

I guess they are also lying when they say this.

Twisted mean twisted pair or wire like in a cat5 cable
each pair of wire is twisted together..

this is not stranded wire..by the way,stranded wire is
more flexible then solid wire and that's the only
difference..

Petem,

Please stop posting all this factual stuff. You're confusing the
idiots.

on a same gauge of wire stranded or not there is no
difference in how the current/voltage of the signal in
it will react..up to a certain frequency...

but the frequency where the difference start to be a
problem is in the high uhf band...

Correct, and that is way beyond anything these bozos work with.

I know about this cause I work a lot with transmission
line in my hobby(ham radio)

Cool. BTW, I used to protect a house on Hartford Rd in
Newington, CT. As a ham operator, I'm sure you know what's
located in a small brick structure on that street. Paul would be
surprised to know that we successfully used several RF sensors in
that installation with no problems coming from the ARRL tower.

of course you have to be careful about the uses of twisted
pair wiring..cause its been known to engineer that build
control panel that simple JKT induce capacitance so they
build there circuit to compensate it..(adding inductance
to it)

Quite right. Some manufacturers actually specify NOT to use TP
cable.

Regards,
Robert L Bass
www.BassBurglarAlarms.com

 

[Robert L Bass]

can you be more specific on some question that

were asked to you...

Is the question about security alarms? If so, I'll be glad to
answer if I know. If you want personal information, speak to me
in person.

since you like to ask for specification when some others
respond to you, it would be kind to do the same for
others?

That depends on the nature of the question and the reason for
asking. Care to be more specific about what question you want
answered?

 

[[email protected]]

why is everyone talking about using twisted pair for alarm hardware ...
??

Telco wire is all yah need ..

Never had an issue with keypads using Telco wire, besides the
occasional one that would give an issue at time of installation where
the solid 24AWG wire would break after bending it a couple times ...
and was fixed then and never had a problem again.

Its not like you are sending video ... just keep away from high
voltage..

 

[Karl Magnus]

That depends on the application. For most alarm system keypads
the answer is yes.

Game over. Busted.

Funny, "Bass" can't handle the fact that many here have worked on a
national level for alarm mfgs, so he gets upset when he realizes he will
never been anything more than a "drop ship monkey".

LOL

 

[joe]

That is utter nonsense. There is no difference in the capability
of stranded or solid conductors to carry higher frequency
signals.

in your reply to Petem you agree that it is better for higher frequency.
Proof that you are either an idiot or you can't read and comprehend what
you have read or you're smoking the weeds down there.

Furthermore, nothing you're likely to use in an alarm

system data loop involves high frequency data.

agreed, but if you read my post and could understandthe written word you
would have known I said COMM circuits. [that means communications for
the mentally less fortunate, that's you BAss]

Try not to confuse yourself. We're not talking about patch
cords.

oh really, because if you could comprehend the written word you would
have known that that is what I just WAS talking about.



I think I have figured out why you can't get a license to install alarms
in Florida even though the test is an OPEN BOOK TEST. You can't read and
comprehend what you have read. It's obvious you twist the meaning of
the written word in you little pea brain. hahahahahahahahahahahahahahah
Bass can't pass an OPEN BOOK TEST. hahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahah
rather than pass an open book test you are gonna let them run you out of
FL. Then you can continue to denigrate the people that CAN pass an OPEN
BOOK TEST and this GREAT COUNTRY from a foriegn land.

 

[petem]

Is the question about security alarms? If so, I'll be glad to
answer if I know. If you want personal information, speak to me
in person.


That depends on the nature of the question and the reason for
asking. Care to be more specific about what question you want
answered?

Well, I wont be more specific since you don't want to do the same.

 

[Crash Gordon]

I use 12ga Romex for all my window contacts so I never have a problem with
breakage.

 

[Frank Olson]

There's that "we" again. But you are not an installer. You're
just a counter clerk.

Heh... You know sooo-o much about me... What's the name of the "small
distributor in Vancouver" I work for again??

You have no experience installing anything.

My customers say differently...

That's why you post idiotic advice to overload output circuits

When have I ever done that??

and "warnings" of the supposed danger using a paddle bit.

You've obviously never hit a nail while using one. I prefer using a regular
twist bid if I'm drilling up (or down) into an area I can't see the other
side of. You might prefer using paddle bits... I think it's bad advice to
suggest using one though.

Anyone
who has ever installed for a living would know you're totally
FOS.

Uh-huh... Funny... I was sorta suggesting the same thing about you, but
decided not to use such "nasty" language. Who's the individual that
recommended hooking up a siren (through a relay of course) to the battery
terminals without installing an inline fuse?? What's the Napco battery
harness for again, "Mr. Napco Expert"??

 

[petem]

Hey Robert!

Can you answer this question?

I can open bet that you will not...at least not with a real answer that can
be confirmed..


the odds are 1 to 1 million so if any one bet 1$ I'll have to pay 1.000.000

I am ready for it...

 

[Crash Gordon]

I re-did a house several years back..the whole house was run under-carpet
with that OLD flat 300 ohm TV antenna wire...remember that stuff...what a
crappy install that was!

 

[Robert L Bass]

So much for the "biggest" online security business in the

state...

It sure beats sitting behind that counter in Canada wishing you
knew how to install something... anything at all.

 

[Robert L Bass]

why is everyone talking about using twisted pair for alarm hardware ...
??

Some idiot got confused thinking stranded cable is the same thing
as twisted pair. After that the thread morphed.

Telco wire is all yah need ..

More specifically, ordinary 22-gauge, 4-conductor, parallel cable
is all you need for almost everything. Very few alarm system
keypads require anything else.

Never had an issue with keypads using Telco wire...

That's because you know what you're doing.

Its not like you are sending video ... just keep away
from high voltage...

Exactly. Speaking of which, a good rule of thumb is to stay one
foot from parallel 110VAC runs and 2 feet from 220VAC. Short
lengths (not more than a few feet) of low voltage can be run in
close proximity to parallel 110/220VAC cable without causing
problems.

Regards,
Robert L Bass
http://www.bassburglaralarms.com/categtype_30.htm

 

[Robert L Bass]

That depends on the nature of the question and the reason for

Well, I wont be more specific since you don't want to do the same.

If you don't tell me what question you want answered, there's not
much chance I can help you.

 

[Robert L Bass]

in your reply to Petem you agree that it is better for higher frequency.

Frequencies way beyond anything you're likely to run into in the
alarms you try to install. None of the systems you install use
transmission lines to carry keypad data so the nonsense about
stranded being better remains... well, nonsense.

agreed...

Proving you already know I'm right.

but if you read my post...

I read it. You tried to sound knowledgeable about something you
don't understand. If you were only ignorant I could help you.
Education cures ignorance. Unfortunately, there's no treatment
for stupidity so I can't do anything for you.

oh really...

Yes, really. Take a look near the top of your newsgroup reader
(that's the program you use to post drivel here). Next to the
word, "Subject" you'll find a text box where it says, "Re: Adding
a third keypad to a Caddx NX-8, wiring help requested!" That
tells you what we're talking about.

 

[Frank Olson]

It sure beats sitting behind that counter in Canada wishing you
knew how to install something... anything at all.

You keep "dancing" around this issue... Why not tell everyone the name of
this so-called "distributor" I work for and get it over with??

What?? You can't?? Well gosh golly gee willickers... I wonder why??

 

[Frank Olson]

If you don't tell me what question you want answered, there's not
much chance I can help you.

I'll give you a clue... It has to do with where I work...

 

[Robert L Bass]

and "warnings" of the supposed danger using a paddle bit.

You've obviously never hit a nail while using one.

Sure I have. If you don't press hard on the drill but let the
bit do the cutting it doesn't damage the bit much. It also won't
grab and hurt you unless you hold the drill so loosely that it
gets away from you. If you have no idea how to use a drill you
might run into problems.

I prefer using a regular twist bid if I'm drilling up
(or down) into an area I can't see the other side of.

I usually use straight bids, but only to get the contract. I
prefer to use bits for drilling. When making a 3/4" hole in a
board a paddle bit is faster and easier to use than a twist bit
-- not to mention about 2% of the price of the bit. It also can
be used in a 3/8" or 1/2" chuck, whereas a 3/4" bit would require
me to drag the big Bosch drill out of the van.

I prefer to use cordless drills most of the time and those drain
the batteries too fast if you use heavy twist drills. Not being
an installer, you wouldn't know any of this stuff.

You might prefer using paddle bits... I think it's bad
advice to suggest using one though.

Only because you have no experience doing this sort of thing.