How to find a reputable installation company

[cam35pilot]

Hi,
What does one need to do to find an installer for a wireless
system for an apartment? Unfortunately "we hire people with long
criminal records" doesn't come up in many company's ads, so can anyone
explain a good way to "check up" on the local installation company? Is
there a bonding agency for such companies?

Rich

 

[Nick Lawrence]

I feel your pain, Rich...

This is because one cannot even rely upon the State licensing
authorities to provide timely and accurate information.

Consider this: Bay Alarm Company, of Pacheco CA, a CA corporation,
claimed to be licensed, but, in fact, operated its unlicensed
burglar/fire alarm business for over five years beginning in late
October 2000, becoming licensed, only after complaints were filed, in
December 2005.

Consider this: Apex Alarm LLC, out of Orem UT, a UT L.L.C. residential
burglar alarm company, also claimed to be licensed in CA, but did not
possess, and was unqualified to obtain, either of the required CA licenses.

Consider this: An unlicensed fire alarm company (name withheld) did not
notify the Southland area CA fire department of the address where the
fire sprinkler alarm system had activated, and a $$$ major loss occurred.

Consider this: Yet another burglary/fire alarm company (name withheld),
with thousands of subscribers, has operated without either of the
required licenses for several years in the San Francisco CA area, and is
presently unable to obtain the required licenses.

Consider this: The examples above are only part of a lot longer list...

 

[Jim]

I feel your pain, Rich...

This is because one cannot even rely upon the State licensing
authorities to provide timely and accurate information.

Consider this: Bay Alarm Company, of Pacheco CA, a CA corporation,
claimed to be licensed, but, in fact, operated its unlicensed
burglar/fire alarm business for over five years beginning in late
October 2000, becoming licensed, only after complaints were filed, in
December 2005.

Consider this: Apex Alarm LLC, out of Orem UT, a UT L.L.C. residential
burglar alarm company, also claimed to be licensed in CA, but did not
possess, and was unqualified to obtain, either of the required CA licenses.

Consider this: An unlicensed fire alarm company (name withheld) did not
notify the Southland area CA fire department of the address where the
fire sprinkler alarm system had activated, and a $$$ major loss occurred.

Consider this: Yet another burglary/fire alarm company (name withheld),
with thousands of subscribers, has operated without either of the
required licenses for several years in the San Francisco CA area, and is
presently unable to obtain the required licenses.

Consider this: The examples above are only part of a lot longer list...

Hmmmm.......

I was waiting to hear your solution for putting a stop to this unique
occurence that only happens in the alarm trade.

 

[Jim]

Hi,
     What does one need to do to find an installer for a wireless
system for an apartment? Unfortunately "we hire people with long
criminal records" doesn't come up in many company's ads, so can anyone
explain a good way to "check up" on the local installation company? Is
there a bonding agency for such companies?

Rich

In this trade the best way is to ask your friends neighbors .....
people and business owners who they use, and if they're satisfied.
Look for alarm stickers and lawn signs and follow up on one or to
common companies in your area.
Interview them or ask them in for an estimate. Call in 4, 5, 6
companies. You'll pretty much be able to tell which one is telling you
the truth and which isn't by the time you're done. There's no
"clearinghouse" as far as I know who would guarantee that someone on
their list would be good for you.

 

[Nick Lawrence]

Not sure unlicensed operators happen only in the alarm trade; I suspect
it happens in other licensed trades/professions as well.

 

[timO']

Not sure unlicensed operators happen only in the alarm trade; I suspect
it happens in other licensed trades/professions as well.

What state are you located? If there are unscrupulous persons doing
alarm work, it is not a reflection on the majority of professionals
but the inability of state authorities to keep up. They're slammed
just like building inspectors and fire marshals who are expected to
cover large jurisdictions with no manpower.

The public also plays into this by shopping on the basis of price.

The regulatory agencies involved in fire and sprinklers are not the
same agencies which watchdog residential burglar alarms.

For an apartment, you might consider doing it yourself since you're
renting.
What kind of equipment do you think you need?
Give me a description of your layout and what floor you live on; I can
easily spec it out for you.

Are you in a metro high crime area?
I can find you a locksmith too.

Or give me your ZIP code and I'll give you a list of licensed
reputable dealers.

All those other negative posts are useless.
<>

 

[Charles Schuler]

In this trade the best way is to ask your friends neighbors .....
people and business owners who they use, and if they're satisfied.
Look for alarm stickers and lawn signs and follow up on one or to
common companies in your area.
Interview them or ask them in for an estimate. Call in 4, 5, 6
companies. You'll pretty much be able to tell which one is telling you
the truth and which isn't by the time you're done. There's no
"clearinghouse" as far as I know who would guarantee that someone on
their list would be good for you.

Good general advice. Find happy customers and join the group.

 

[Bill]

In my opinion...

So far as not having criminals working for them, I suppose an alarm company
which installs "U.L. Grade Alarms" and has a U.L. certified monitoring
center might have a better process of checking out their employees than
others. (Since they would be installing higher security systems.) I think
most alarm companies are careful who they hire though.

Note that most burglars are not very bright and prefer to NOT work. So most
would not think of getting a job at an alarm company. Watch America's
Dumbest Criminals. This is who you are dealing with mostly. Than any
burglars who ARE intelligent are not going to be breaking into apartments
typically. So not to worry...

So far as dealing with an honest alarm company which will not try to rip you
off (and doing business with companies in general) - large corporations are
more likely to squeeze every last nickel out of you and have you sign
contracts which take you to the cleaners for years to come. (Read every
single word in any contracts! Beware!) Small mom and pop companies tend to
be more ethical.

 

[Robert L Bass]

So far as not having criminals working for them,

I suppose an alarm company which installs
"U.L. Grade Alarms" and has a U.L. certified
monitoring center might have a better process
of checking out their employees than others...

Where in the UL standard does it forbid hiring
an ex-felon to work in a central station or even
as an alarm installer?

(Since they would be installing higher security
systems.) I think most alarm companies are
careful who they hire though.

Being UL listed doesn't measn the alarm company
installs only UL certificated alarms. They might
do as little as 1% of their systems to UL standards
and the rest could be "lick 'n' stick" nonsense.

Note that most burglars are not very bright
and prefer to NOT work...

True. Most burglars are drug and/or alcohol
dependent and are only looking for enough to
buy the next fix or bottle.

So most would not think of getting a job at
an alarm company...

There's one guy who worked in sales for a
competitor in CT. He would ask the usual
questions about the client's needs, check the
house and design a system. He also asked
about the family's schedule -- when the
kids come home from school, etc.

If the customer didn't buy he'd call back after
a few days to ask if they'd made a selection.
If not, he'd rob the house the next day.

*Then* he would call again after a day or
two saying he'd read about a burglary "in
the neighborhood" and was concerned for
them. The guy was his company's top
salesman until some cop figured it out
and they set up a sting.

So far as dealing with an honest alarm
company which will not try to rip you off (and doing business with companies
in general) - large corporations are more likely to squeeze every last nickel
out of you and have you sign contracts
which take you to the cleaners for years
to come...

There seems to be a pretty much equal
mix of good and bad companies. There
does not appear to be a correlation between
company size and honesty. The one area
where there does seem to be a higher
percentage of rotten apples is among the
so-called "authorized dealer" programs.

(Read every single word in any contracts!
Beware!)...

Excellent advice.

Small mom and pop companies tend to be more ethical.

Some are. Some aren't. This isn't intended
as a slight against any particular alarm
company or group of companies. The alarm
industry, like any other business , has good
and bad eggs.

--

Regards,
Robert L Bass

=============================>
Bass Home Electronics
941-925-8650
4883 Fallcrest Circle
Sarasota · Florida · 34233
http://www.bassburglaralarms.com
=============================>

 

[Petem]

Where in the UL standard does it forbid hiring
an ex-felon to work in a central station or even
as an alarm installer?

I am sure that you know allot about this topic...

after all, being an ex-felon yourself,its something you kind of have to
know...

 

[Bill]

"Robert L Bass" wrote in message

Where in the UL standard does it forbid hiring
an ex-felon to work in a central station or even
as an alarm installer?

It does not, however these alarm companies are more likely to do business
with "certain" customers who are quite picky about how the alarm company
screens their employees. So the alarm company might design their hiring
practices to get the business of these few customers. But this is a good
selling point for selling to *all* customers. "We do bla bla bla to screen
our employees, etc. The other companies in town do not..."

 

[Robert L Bass]

Where in the UL standard does it forbid hiring

It does not, however these alarm companies
are more likely to do business with "certain"
customers who are quite picky about how the
alarm company screens their employees...

Perhaps that's true but over the 24 years I ran a
small alarm company I think there were at most
two or three customers who asked if we were
bonded. Although I didn't do banks, we had a
number of jewelry stores, lots of city government
clients and so forth.

I don't recall if anyone ever asked me how or
even if we screened our employees. We were
a small company though. I mainly hired people
who were referred to me by other employees
and sub-contractors.

So the alarm company might design their
hiring practices to get the business of these
few customers...

They might be very careful, checking backgrounds,
giving thorough training, etc. They might also
simply hire amyone who walks in off the street,
give them a few days' in-service training and turn
them loose. I've seen both and that's from large,
UL-listed firms as well as small, mom-and-pop
outfits.

But this is a good selling point for selling to
*all* customers...

Agreed. It sounds good to the prospective client
and that helps close a sale.

"We do bla bla bla to screen our employees,
etc. The other companies in town do not..."

I'd leave out the dig on the competitors. That's
a major turn-off to most customers. Just tell them
how great you are. If they ask about another
company tell them, "They're a competitor. I
prefer to let them stand or fall on their own merits."
Then continue with your presentation. I guaranty
you will blow the bad-mouthers out of the water
99% of the time.

--

Regards,
Robert L Bass

=============================>
Bass Home Electronics
941-925-8650
4883 Fallcrest Circle
Sarasota · Florida · 34233
http://www.bassburglaralarms.com
=============================>

 

[Frank Olson]

Perhaps that's true but over the 24 years I ran a
small alarm company I think there were at most
two or three customers who asked if we were
bonded. Although I didn't do banks, we had a
number of jewelry stores, lots of city government
clients and so forth.

We will of course ignore the fact that most insurers of jewelry stores
require UL Listed installations and monitoring (in Canada that's ULC)
and that by your own admission your company wasn't certified to do
either. As to Hartford's "City Government", I can't comment on their
particular requirements. For Vancouver, and the surrounding environs,
you can't even qualify to bid a "City Government" job without the
requisite licensing, bonding, insurance and ULC certification.

I don't recall if anyone ever asked me how or
even if we screened our employees. We were
a small company though. I mainly hired people
who were referred to me by other employees
and sub-contractors.

I did that once. In Edmonton. A company I worked for hired a guy that
was recommended by the manager of one of the distributors we used. We
wound up dismissing him a few weeks later when he couldn't provide a
clearance letter from the City Police Department. It's just plain
*stupid* for any security company not to screen their employees (or
their sub-contractors). The very LAST THING I would want a competitor
to be able to use against your company would be the fact that you're in
the habit of hiring a person without performing your due diligence.