help newbe with 8051 uC

[mc]

Then, I got a gig where I used the 68HC11. I fell in love. Naturally,

that beautiful Motorola architecture seems to have gone the way of the
passenger pigeon. Sigh.

Replaced by the 'HC12, which is 16-bit.

 

[Pooh Bear]

I've used an 8035, which is an 8051 with no ROM

Actually the 8035 is a member of the MCS48 family, not the MCS51 family.

it needs an external program memory

So does the 8051.

Graham

 

[David]

Know any good compilers and a good book? I'ld like to learn to program
8051s. I've gotten an 8051 eval board from PJRC, but I'm just a newbe.
I've been doing C++ in MSVC for years and played with Basic Stamp
modules, but now onto 8051's. I'm looking for a compiler and a good
book. PJRC says to use SDCC, but a DOS window is kinda yukie. I've
used MicroChips MPLAB IDE for their robotic controller built around an
8520(?) but it doesn't target the 8253 in my eval board.

If you are looking to start working with small embedded micros, there is
no reason you should pick the 8051. It's a dinosaur architecture, with
poor tool support if you can't afford the Kiel compiler. Of course, it
is vastly superior to the PIC, but you can do a lot better. The best
choices would normally be an AVR or an MSP430.

If using a "DOS" window (you really mean a command prompt - just because
Microsoft doesn't know what it's called, is no excuse for others getting
it wrong) is a problem for you, then you are not going to get far in
this field - compilers are by nature command line tools, and IDEs that
put a pretty face on top will only get you so far. It's like refusing
to learn to understand assembly while still wanting to write good code
for a small micro - it can't be done.

The 8051 does have one major strong point, however - it is popular.
There are endless variations of microcontrollers using 8051 cores,
meaning you can get them from dozens of different suppliers (not that
they are directly interchangeable), and it is often the choice for
suppliers wanting to add a cpu to an existing chip (such as an ADC, or a
radio chip with an added cpu).

 

[mc]

is vastly superior to the PIC, but you can do a lot better. The best

choices would normally be an AVR or an MSP430.

I agree, although the 8051 does keep spawning interesting variants.

If using a "DOS" window (you really mean a command prompt - just because
Microsoft doesn't know what it's called, is no excuse for others getting
it wrong)

Actually, Microsoft isn't confused. Windows 2000 and up have both a DOS
prompt and a Windows command prompt, and although the command languages are
similar, the two are entirely distinct things. To see a DOS prompt (rarely
seen), choose Run... and type "command.com". To see a Windows command
prompt, either choose it from your menu or go to Run... and type "cmd.exe".

is a problem for you, then you are not going to get far in this field -
compilers are by nature command line tools, and IDEs that put a pretty
face on top will only get you so far. It's like refusing to learn to
understand assembly while still wanting to write good code for a small
micro - it can't be done.

The 8051 does have one major strong point, however - it is popular. There
are endless variations of microcontrollers using 8051 cores, meaning you
can get them from dozens of different suppliers (not that they are
directly interchangeable), and it is often the choice for suppliers
wanting to add a cpu to an existing chip (such as an ADC, or a radio chip
with an added cpu).

Well said on both points.

 

[Spehro Pefhany]

Actually the 8035 is a member of the MCS48 family, not the MCS51 family.
True.


So does the 8051.

Graham

You're thinking of the 8031, though you can use an 8051 as an 8031 and
just ignore the internal 4K ROM, by tying /EA low.


Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany

 

[Pooh Bear]

You're thinking of the 8031, though you can use an 8051 as an 8031 and
just ignore the internal 4K ROM, by tying /EA low.

Tssk ! Silly me. I was thinking about 87(C)51 89C/S51 etc and forgot the latter
numbers ! You're quite right of course.

My current fave version of the family is 89S52/3 btw. Stunning pricing and flash
ROM.

Graham

 

[David]

Actually, Microsoft isn't confused. Windows 2000 and up have both a DOS
prompt and a Windows command prompt, and although the command languages are
similar, the two are entirely distinct things. To see a DOS prompt (rarely
seen), choose Run... and type "command.com". To see a Windows command
prompt, either choose it from your menu or go to Run... and type "cmd.exe".

Yes, most windows forks these days refers to it as a "command prompt".
But for a long time, Microsoft did their best to confuse the issue -
including combinations (on NT 4.0, IIRC) as calling it a "command
prompt" while using an icon for MS-DOS. Basically, they wanted people
who needed to use old DOS programs to be able to find a command shell,
while hoping that everyone else would use point-and-drool windows for
everything. The irony, of course, is that the windows shell has been
steadily improving as Microsoft realises that it is a vital tool for
power users. Perhaps by Vista, it will have evolved into a shell as
powerful as unix shells were 20 years ago.

My main point, however, was that an embedded developer should not be
scared of using a command prompt and running programs like "make" or
creating small batch files or shell scripts. You quickly find it is a
very fast and flexible way of using the computer.

 

[Roy L. Fuchs]

Know any good compilers and a good book? I'ld like to learn to program
8051s. I've gotten an 8051 eval board from PJRC, but I'm just a newbe.
I've been doing C++ in MSVC for years and played with Basic Stamp
modules, but now onto 8051's. I'm looking for a compiler and a good
book. PJRC says to use SDCC, but a DOS window is kinda yukie. I've
used MicroChips MPLAB IDE for their robotic controller built around an
8520(?) but it doesn't target the 8253 in my eval board.

Boot up Knoppix and find a good one that will work under Linux.

You won't regret stepping into the new realm either, as the
experience of familiarity with Linux can go a long way in the
industry.

Knoppix will boot and will NOT write to any hard drives, so your
system is safe. You may have to have a PC that boots to DOS or
Windows to run the programmer though. Sad, that.

http://www.knoppix.org/

Be sure to click your flag to get the correct language page up.

Best damned diagnostic boot disc there is as well.

 

[joseph2k]

300°C -> what kind of solder do I need for that...

Last i heard when operating temperatures go above 200C, systems go all
welded (usually ultrasonically).