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Whole house "battery" wiring/power...

T

The Daring Dufas

aemeijers said:
So what does FLNF stand for? Google was clueless.

Funny Little Nose Fart, it's the sound you make when you
laugh with your mouth closed. Then there is FLNFWSp, which
is Funny Little Nose Fart With Spray. It happens when you
see an intellectual post from krw and you have a mouthful
of your preferred beverage.

TDD
 
T

The Daring Dufas

krw said:
You're clearly a Demonicrat. That's your style, stupid.

Oh man are you ever out in left field. You can't even spell
your insults. Besides, Republicans disgust me but Democrats
are special, they horrify me. Perhaps I should call you Dr.
Sung who's nickname was "Often Wrong". FLNF

TDD
 
T

The Daring Dufas

Archimedes' Lever said:
Our pot core transformers resonated very nicely at around 56kHz, and
that was regardless of how the windings were configured.

Did you have any RFI problems with your power supplies? Oh yea,
don't let krw know about your pot core transformers, he/she/it
will try to steal them and smoke them. FLNF

TDD
 
J

James Sweet

The said:
Funny Little Nose Fart, it's the sound you make when you
laugh with your mouth closed. Then there is FLNFWSp, which
is Funny Little Nose Fart With Spray. It happens when you
see an intellectual post from krw and you have a mouthful
of your preferred beverage.

TDD



Are you guys done with your little pissing match yet?
 
T

The Daring Dufas

James said:
Are you guys done with your little pissing match yet?

I hope so, it's getting boring and very predictable.
The guy is very much like another creep who pollutes
alt.2600 calling himself Hatter. At least the jerk
doesn't have a two page long pretentious sig.

TDD
 
J

James Sweet

I hope so, it's getting boring and very predictable.
The guy is very much like another creep who pollutes
alt.2600 calling himself Hatter. At least the jerk
doesn't have a two page long pretentious sig.

TDD


Add them to a blocked sender list (killfile) and call it good. Such is
the nature of usenet. My filter list for the EE group is bigger than
I've ever had anywhere else.
 
T

The Daring Dufas

James said:
Add them to a blocked sender list (killfile) and call it good. Such is
the nature of usenet. My filter list for the EE group is bigger than
I've ever had anywhere else.

I don't have many in my killfile. If the guy was posting
page after page of junk I would killfile him and never
see another post of his unless someone responded to his
nonsense. It can be entertaining in a sophomoric kind of
way until it gets boring.

TDD
 
A

Archimedes' Lever

KEEP DREAMING KILLJOY

YOU ARE THE ABUSIVE OVERBEARING ILLUSTRIOUS ONE

YOU MULTINYM FAGGOTY SORE LOSING TROLL

YOU STARTED THE SHIT THE SHIT ENDS WHEN YOU SHUT YOUR ANAL TROLLOPING
ABUSIVE ACCOUNT DOWN YOURSELF

I AM HERE FOR THE REMAINDER OF THE LIFESPAN OF THIS GROUP

I AM PROTEUS


Don't be so sure. gmail is looking for a face lift, and getting rid of
abusers like you is on their to-do list.

Essentially, your days are numbered as an abuser of this group.
 
J

Jules

That's actually a bit different. The AC/DC radios he refers to use a
transformerless power supply with the tube heaters wired in series.

For sure - it just stirred some braincells, that's all. The particular
radio I remembered was an early (ish) transistor design - I think it may
have been a Grundig, but I can't be certain now. The 12VDC ability was
just to allow it to be run from a car battery whilst camping - I seem to
recall my folks having a (black&white) TV that could run from a car
battery, too, but I don't recall if it had a manual voltage switch like
the radio did.

Just struck me as interesting that it was (in theory) so easy to plug in
to AC (via the same connector) with the voltage on the wrong setting and
presumably cook the thing!
The worst offenders for radios being plugged into the wrong voltage are
32V farm radios. The old 32VDC rural systems used the same plugs and
receptacles as the 110VAC systems standard elsewhere, so it's common for
someone unknowledgeable to plug a farm radio into a 120V receptacle and
blow all the tube heaters.

Well, I grew up in the UK, and it's been 240VAC as standard over there in
just about forever (well, near enough, Google tells me 1916) - although I
think some DC via private generation in big, isolated houses survived into
the 1920's. The historical picture in the US is a lot more diverse, it
seems (and more interesting because of it :)

cheers

Jules
 
J

James Sweet

Well, I grew up in the UK, and it's been 240VAC as standard over there in
just about forever (well, near enough, Google tells me 1916) - although I
think some DC via private generation in big, isolated houses survived into
the 1920's. The historical picture in the US is a lot more diverse, it
seems (and more interesting because of it :)

cheers

Jules


The differences, both historical and current are fascinating from either
perspective. I've had some extensive discussions with an EE friend over
in Manchester and we're both learning something new all the time.

I don't think I've ever asked if there were ever DC rural systems over
there. These were off-grid and typically had a bank of lead-acid cells
which were charged by gasoline or steam driven generators or windmills.
There were 32V versions of virtually every small appliance of the day.
Radios, fans, food mixers, etc. They made sense when farmhouses were
often miles from the next house and more miles to the nearest town.
 
D

Don Kelly

James Sweet said:
The differences, both historical and current are fascinating from either
perspective. I've had some extensive discussions with an EE friend over in
Manchester and we're both learning something new all the time.

I don't think I've ever asked if there were ever DC rural systems over
there. These were off-grid and typically had a bank of lead-acid cells
which were charged by gasoline or steam driven generators or windmills.
There were 32V versions of virtually every small appliance of the day.
Radios, fans, food mixers, etc. They made sense when farmhouses were often
miles from the next house and more miles to the nearest town.

And most farmers were quite happy to tie to the grid when it became
possible - helping to build lines as well-- lots of rural electrification
co-operatives came into being in the late 40's. My father was involved
(from the utility side) with the the first one in Alberta, Canada, and the
farmers were more than welcoming. The old windcharger/battery systems worked
reasonably well for supplying lighting and small appliances but weren't
capable of handling the heavier loads around the farms.
 
A

Archimedes' Lever

This could have been a very interesting thread if it were not for the
few insecure nerds/geeks who think they have to prove something about
their engineering prowess, and just wind up looking like a person with
drastic insecurity issues.

Mouthy, immature little fucktards like you are the dopes attempting to
foist stupidity as 'prowess'.
I did however offer a marketable solution to your proposal, if you can
find it somewhere in this mess.

Yet another retarded insult, veiled as assistance.
Few others of these supposedly "illustrious" engineers actually
offered anything worthwhile from what I can see.

Yes, but your opinion means very little. Less than that even.

Yes... wussified little fucking punks like you are just that.
 
J

Jules

And most farmers were quite happy to tie to the grid when it became
possible - helping to build lines as well-- lots of rural electrification
co-operatives came into being in the late 40's.

Interesting stuff. I never knew they had any real off-grid networks; I'd
only ever heard of local generation supplying single dwellings. Shame
there doesn't seem to be much about all of this on the 'net.
The old windcharger/battery
systems worked reasonably well for supplying lighting and small
appliances but weren't capable of handling the heavier loads around the
farms.

Take out the 'old' and that probably still stands ;)

cheers

Jules
 
D

Don Kelly

Interesting stuff. I never knew they had any real off-grid networks; I'd
only ever heard of local generation supplying single dwellings. Shame
there doesn't seem to be much about all of this on the 'net.


Take out the 'old' and that probably still stands ;)

cheers

Jules- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Edison went to great political lengths to discourage AC, even publicly
electrocuting animals to show how AC causes heart failure where the
equivalent DC voltage would not.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Topsy_(elephant)

As you know the very nature of DC required multiple grids and an
endless supply of local generating plants, all of which Edison wanted
to provide.

My relatives have a farm in central IL with a generating windmill,
this farm only got on the grid after WW2. In the 1930's windmill
manufacturers in the US were producing about 100,000 windmills a year
for farms that had no access to electrical grids. It used storage
batteries. Funny how the wind circle is now being repeated.



These farmers weren't on any off- grid network. Some had windchargers and
some may have had generators but many were still without electricity of any
sort. Windmills to pump water, kerosene lamps. and wood or coal for heating.
The co-operative effort was to get connected to the grid at a time when
there were few, if any, farms remote from towns that did have grid
connections. This meant building a local distribution system and the utility
providing the tie to the grid and operation of the system.
The first case was in a tightly connected Mennonite "colony" and later ones
were more general groups of farmers after the success of this one. In
general rural (and urban) population densities were (and still are) lower
than those in IL(about 1/10 the population in 5 times the area-admittedly
mostly concentrated in the lower half (prairie/parkland)of the province ).
 
D

Don Kelly

Archimedes' Lever said:
But he was wrong, and DC kills as well. Including the onset of
ventricular fibrillation.
-----
The sensitivity of humans and other mammals, with regard to frequency
happens to peak in the 50-60Hz range. Edison took advantage of this and
Tesla countered with high frequency, high voltage discharges, saying, in
effect, "this is AC, perfectly safe" Both lied (whether they knew it or
not and the not was shown much later) with profit as a motive. Other
hazards such as arcing at switches or poor contacts, worse with DC, were
ignored.
 
A

Archimedes' Lever

Edison went to great political lengths to discourage AC, even publicly
electrocuting animals to show how AC causes heart failure where the
equivalent DC voltage would not.


But he was wrong, and DC kills as well. Including the onset of
ventricular fibrillation.
 
J

Jules

Other
hazards such as arcing at switches or poor contacts, worse with DC, were
ignored.

I recall the breakers at one site I was working at fed compressed air
through the breaker upon opening, just to extinguish any arc that may have
formed (that was a 400V DC setup) - I think that's typical on higher power
DC stuff. The breakers were about the size of a lunchbox.

cheers

Jules
 
D

daestrom

Jules said:
I recall the breakers at one site I was working at fed compressed air
through the breaker upon opening, just to extinguish any arc that may have
formed (that was a 400V DC setup) - I think that's typical on higher power
DC stuff. The breakers were about the size of a lunchbox.

Hi voltage AC breakers still do use compressed air in some. The 'blast'
is aimed between the arcing contacts to literally blow out the arc.

Lower voltage DC (up to 350VDC) that we used on submarines just used
blow-out coils to create a magnetic field that 'pushed' the
arc-conducting gases up into chutes lined with alternating metal and
insulating plates that would cool and stretch the arc.

But I've seen enough stuff that I know I haven't seen everything :)

daestrom
 
J

Jules

Hi voltage AC breakers still do use compressed air in some. The 'blast'
is aimed between the arcing contacts to literally blow out the arc.

Lower voltage DC (up to 350VDC) that we used on submarines just used
blow-out coils to create a magnetic field that 'pushed' the
arc-conducting gases up into chutes lined with alternating metal and
insulating plates that would cool and stretch the arc.

Interesting - not seen those before. 'ours' were WWII-vintage, and there
was compressed air in the same room as part of the air-start system for
the generators, so I suppose it was no big deal to route it to the
electrical switchboard too.
But I've seen enough stuff that I know I haven't seen everything :)

:) I'm sure there were all sorts of ways and means of extinguishing
arcs, though - some of which may have worked better than others!

It'd be interesting to know what larger power stations etc. did, too. Had
some friends in NZ with a smaller plant (2,500 kVA) but I've not talked to
them in quite a while, and I don't recall anything obviously resembling
breakers on the site, although I assume they were there somewhere!

cheers

Jules
 
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