Maker Pro
Maker Pro

I'm Grandfathered in, for now.

Den fredag den 1. november 2013 19.37.34 UTC+1 skrev [email protected]:




is insurance companies bureaucracy to administer it and profit from it any
better?

What you don't understand is that Obamacare has a government
website, and a hub, a huge new department in every state, and
something close to 160 new federal agencies, IN ADDITION to
the existing insurance companies, which Obamacare subsidizes.

The exchange all by itself adds a 3% fee on top of the insurers'
premiums. That's more overhead, not less.

Cheers,
James Arthur
 
Jim Thompson wrote:

[...]

The only good that will come of this is that so many Democrat
politicians will lose their ass in the 2014 mid-terms.
We'd wish, but ... read up on the topic "ineptocracy" :-(

Obama's big mistake was adopting the Republican healthcare plan (aka
Romneycare).

Of course in our system Obama doesn't have the power to
"adopt" anything; he has to propose and pass it.

His big mistake was lying about it to get it passed, and to
get himself re-elected. Now it's come back to bite him.

But yes, it was also a mistake to think that one party could
steal peoples' plans and impose their will on a whole nation
without repercussions. That they lied (and continue to)
makes it all the worse.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/theapot...e-to-keep-their-health-plans-under-obamacare/


Cheers,
James Arthur
 
G

Greegor

JA > Of course in our system Obama doesn't have the power to
JA > "adopt" anything; he has to propose and pass it.

The "Affordable Care Act (ACA) "Obamacare"
allows wide ranging changes "promulgation"
at the descretion of the Secretery of HHS Sebelius.

Bills are passed into law, rules are "promulgated".

It's a bit like having a whole array of
Presidential "Czars" for various issues.
 
Demcare doesn't fix the insurance company's measly profit, and it

doesn't reduce the overhead.

It most certainly does, they are allowed no more than 15% for costs other than actual health care, and if they exceed that percentage they will owe their clients a rebate. That is the new law.
"It is amazing that people who think we cannot afford to pay for doctors,hospitals, and medication somehow think that we can afford to pay for doctors, hospitals, medication and a government bureaucracy to administer it." --Sowell

That's exactly the point of the PPACA, they ARE getting government out of the health insurance business. If you pay attention, you will see that all the PPACA is doing is regulating the industry, the private insurance companies will be doing all the actual administration work. Representatives of theinsurance industry who know the business inside out wrote the law!
 
It most certainly does, they are allowed no more than 15% for costs otherthan actual health care, and if they exceed that percentage they will owe their clients a rebate. That is the new law.

That's the "Minimum Loss Ratio" provision. It says for every dollar
insurers spend, they get to keep 15 cents. Let's put on our thinking
caps and ask "Okay, what's the insurer's incentive? What's the
easiest way for him to make an extra 15 cents?"

If you said "Spend another dollar," you get a prize.

That's exactly the point of the PPACA, they ARE getting government out ofthe health insurance business. If you pay attention, you will see that allthe PPACA is doing is regulating the industry, the private insurance companies will be doing all the actual administration work. Representatives of the insurance industry who know the business inside out wrote the law!

The ACA doesn't get the government out of health insurance! Read section
1311 -- the feds now have to approve and inspect the FORMS you use. They
control EVERYTHING.
 
G

Greegor

They've known from the beginning that
getting young healthy people to sign
up is necessary for it to work.

Now there are reports that in fact
those people are busy repaying student
loans, hoping to buy homes and
would pay the 1% tax/fine rather
than sign up.
 
J

Joerg

Lasse said:
Den fredag den 1. november 2013 21.35.37 UTC+1 skrev Joerg:


big IT project have a tendency to get ridiculously expensive, I'm not
sure big companies are much better at it than governments, they just
don't go public with it

Big companies are much better. This would not have happened at IBM, it
would not have happened at Facebook, or any reputable biz with major web
site or cloud exposure. The best ones are usually smaller outfits.

but to put the 635M in perspective, in 2011 that would be around 6
weeks of profit for UnitedHealth Group

with that kind of money involved I'm sure they spend a lot in
lobbying and contributions to avoid be cut out of the loop by a
single payer system

Sure they do, it's natural. Plus single payer systems mostly don't work
so well.
 
Den fredag den 1. november 2013 21.35.37 UTC+1 skrev Joerg:


big IT project have a tendency to get ridiculously expensive, I'm not sure big companies are much better at it than governments, they just don't go public
with it

Amazon, Google, and Youtube are just a few examples that show how
wrong you are. Well, you've done a good job of showing that even
Google can screw up a UI. The back room works pretty well, though.
but to put the 635M in perspective, in 2011 that would be around 6 weeks of profit for UnitedHealth Group

If true, it's irrelevant.
with that kind of money involved I'm sure they spend a lot in lobbying and contributions to avoid be cut out of the loop by a single payer system

You don't think insurance companies got their two pounds into
Obamacare. You socialists really are naive.
 
That's the "Minimum Loss Ratio" provision. It says for every dollar

insurers spend, they get to keep 15 cents. Let's put on our thinking

caps and ask "Okay, what's the insurer's incentive? What's the

easiest way for him to make an extra 15 cents?"



If you said "Spend another dollar," you get a prize.

That's not the way it's going to work because the government specifies, andalways has specified through NIH, treatment guidelines. Deviation from NIHtreatment guidelines= malpractice liability, it has been this way for decades now, it's nothing new.
The ACA doesn't get the government out of health insurance! Read section

1311 -- the feds now have to approve and inspect the FORMS you use. They

control EVERYTHING.

Of course, that's the way it has to be, government control is synonymous with uniformity. This may come as a shock to you, but the insurance industry has wanted this for several decades now, they just couldn't justify it to their stockholders. But it does explain how the law was written so fast by insurance industry executive level insiders, they KNEW what had to be done, the government could NEVER have produced this legislation if they had a million years.
 
J

Joerg

Greegor said:
They've known from the beginning that
getting young healthy people to sign
up is necessary for it to work.

Now there are reports that in fact
those people are busy repaying student
loans, hoping to buy homes and
would pay the 1% tax/fine rather
than sign up.

Not just students and young people. Lots of people in their 30's and
40's with incomes above the government subsidy threshold live paycheck
to paycheck, along with some hefty five-digit credit card debt. They
have about the financial "discipline" of our government which is what
got them into this situation. Even if they were willing to plunk down
$1k or more per month for a family plan, they can't.

Those who do buy an Obamacare plan and are above the thresholds will
soon discover that it's really only catastrophic coverage and that they
must pay the first few thousand Dollars out of pocket. Dollars they
ain't got.

Imagine a guy picking up his son from the hospital after he turfed it
badly on his skateboard. He was dumped out of his previous family plan
despite Obama having promised they could keep it, so now he has an
Obamacare bronze plan. "Sir, that'll be $786.43 please" ... "WHAT?!".
This will happen before the next election and registered Democrats are
not exempt from it.
 
B

Bill Sloman

Jim Thompson wrote:

[...]
The only good that will come of this is that so many Democrat politicians will lose their ass in the 2014 mid-terms.

We'd wish, but ... read up on the topic "ineptocracy" :-(

Our present crop of college students and recent grads, and their attitudeof shouting down any free speech they don't want to hear, are sufficient reason to dispose of state-funded universities... and "low information" voters.

Around here, Jim Thompson and krw have been shouting down any free speech they don't want to hear for years. It's odd that Jim resents the present crop of college students for exercising the same lack of restraint.
The only way taxpayer funding should be involved is _perhaps_ for scholarships... recipient qualification to be determined by examination only... no"equal opportunity" BS.

Sadly, examinations are a pretty poor way of selecting university entrants.Kids that do very well on examinations do tend to ace their university course with 95% graduation rates, but for the bulk of the people who do well enough to get into university only around half ever make it through to a degree, and the bottom 10% don't do all that much worse than the rest.
 
B

Bill Sloman

You're now ahead of Slowman for extraordinary exhibition of asininity

Jim-out-of-touch-with-reality-Thompson calls krw an ass. He's right of course, but his reasoning is as defective as ever.
 
B

Bill Sloman

I can't help it if you're as illiterate as Slowman.

If only Jim Thompson were as well-read as I am. He's never caught John Woodgate trying to pass off a quote from Thomas Love Peacock as if were a primitive Celtic song, but I have ...
 
Jim Thompson wrote:

[...]

The only good that will come of this is that so many Democrat politicians will lose their ass in the 2014 mid-terms.

We'd wish, but ... read up on the topic "ineptocracy" :-(

Our present crop of college students and recent grads, and their attitude of shouting down any free speech they don't want to hear, are sufficient reason to dispose of state-funded universities... and "low information" voters.

Around here, Jim Thompson and krw have been shouting down any free speech they don't want to hear for years. It's odd that Jim resents the present crop of college students for exercising the same lack of restraint.

You're such a liar, Slowman. Of course, you're a lefty so that's only
expected of you.
Sadly, examinations are a pretty poor way of selecting university entrants. Kids that do very well on examinations do tend to ace their university course with 95% graduation rates, but for the bulk of the people who do well enough to get into university only around half ever make it through to a degree, and the bottom 10% don't do all that much worse than the rest.

Sadly, they're the best way.
 
If only Jim Thompson were as well-read as I am. He's never caught John Woodgate trying to pass off a quote from Thomas Love Peacock as if were a primitive Celtic song, but I have ...

You only show that you don't know the difference between reading and
comprehension. It is interesting that you recognize the similarity
between the two of you, though.
 
B

Bill Sloman

You only show that you don't know the difference between reading and comprehension. It is interesting that you recognize the similarity between the two of you, though.

Your claim was "illiterate" which means "can't read at all, let alone comprehend". You've just illustrated the shallowness of your own comprehension.
And now you will tell me that I'm lying, which will be particularly amusing..

There are some similarities between me and Jim - we are both experts in ourdifferent fields of electronics, and haven't got much of a clue about whatthe other actually does, but we both can give useful advice from time to time, which isn't a skill that you've ever demonstrated here. I even gave Jim a useful hint once - a long time ago.
 
B

Bill Sloman

The truth sometimes hurts, but it is still the truth.

krw's grasp of "truth" and "lies" is idiosyncratic. He certainly doesn't use either word - or the word "proof" - in the way the normal people do. My best guess is that he sees them as emotionally loaded emphasisers that don'tactually mean anything. For him, calling someone a "lying idiot" seems to have exactly the same information content as calling them a "bloody idiot".
 
Top