Fisher VCR model FVH-721 No Power

[bandit]

Hello everyone,
I have an old fisher VCR that won't power up. I am not sure if it is a "timing / alignment"
problem, or perhaps a power supply problem. The unit was working before I decided to replace the belts. After installing the new belts is when I encountered the power up problem. When I re-pluged the unit, it would not power on. The power button light comes on for about 5 seconds & then goes out. The LED display flashes but nothing else works.
I checked the fuse & ran a continuity test on it which showed the fuse is good.

Would appreciate anyone that can tell me the proper "timing / alignment" procedure. Also,
any suggestions if it's a power supply issue. There must be a reason why the unit will not power up. I am at wits end trying to figure out the cause of this.

Thank you !!
The Bandit

 

[Tesla]

If you just replaced the belts without removing any gears, and the belts didn't have any "teeth" on them, it's unlikely it's a mech. timing problem. The designers know smooth belts might slip a little over time.

If you have to remove or replace gears, it helps to mark them and touching gears with a sharpie, don't turn the mech., and put it back they way it was. If you do this, you can usually get away with not "re-timing" the mech.

Your problem sounds more like a lose connector or a power supply problem. PS problems on old VCRs is fairly common. Maybe cause they stay on all the time (unlike something like a DVD player that gets turned off when not in use).

There should be an output connector on the PS that feeds the rest of the VCR. Off of that connector, you should be able to read all your PS output voltages.

EDIT: Sorry, just re-read your original post. If the display stays on (even if it's flashing) ... that means most of the Power Supply and main board are working. You still might be missing the motor or tape mech. voltages, but not as likely. Probably just a connector or mech. problem. I don't think the VCR will go fully on (ready to play a tape) if the mech. timing is too far off.

 

[shrtrnd]

Agree with Tesla. You may have knocked the tape transport out of alignment (that feeds tape into machine), tripping a microswitch that makes the machine think it's done, and should power down. Or knocked a connector loose somewhere inside when you were changing the belt,... something simple or out of alignment mechanically. If you haven't already, unplug VCR, and plug it in again, to reboot it's start-up function. These things rely totally on which switch is tripped, and when (if all your connectors are secure). I'd be looking mechanical on yours, probably not electrical. I think your machine thinks it's SUPPOSED to turn-off, for whatever reason.

 

[bandit]

Hi guys,
Thanks for the replies. I agree that most likely it's a mechanical issue more than anything else. I just can't figure it out on my own. I did mark the gears before taking them out. I just can't seem to find the proper timming sequence. Nothing has changed from the original symptoms I described. After studying & trying my best to find the proper timming sequence, to no avail, and in between the different sequences I tried, I found one sequence which I wrote down that partially worked, whereby, the power light did stay on. (The process involved a little persuation on the order of slightly moving a pulley by hand on the load motor that moves the gears.)

However, I noticed that the load motor located under the deck did not reset itself when I re-plugged. Since the power light stayed on despite this, I inserted a cassette & hit the play button. The cassette went in and down smoothly as expected because I changed all the belts.Unfortunately, the loading motor underneath the deck which turns the gears will NOT turn. I know the latch works because I can feel & hear a click, but the motor itself wont spin to move the gears. 5 seconds later the power light went out. When I replugged, the power light goes on again but shuts off 5 seconds later.

I know something is out of wack. Just what it is I can't figure out. Even if I found the service manual on line someplace, I don't think with my limited experience that it could offer me a solution. If any of you can think this out with me and offer a solution I'd be very gratefull. I am willing to keep trying to resolve this issue. Thank you for replying for I value your expertise.

The Bandit

P.S. I have lots of spare parts from a similar broken Fisher FVH-720 (older model) that a
relative gave to me years ago.

 

[Tesla]

I think Fisher might be made by Sanyo or use Sanyo mechs.

Go to: http://www.eserviceinfo.com/

Search for: sanyo
Class: Video recorders

Download and unzip those files (some have 2 parts). I looked at the "sanyo 92" file. It appeared to have the timing procedure for a tape mech... it might match or be close enough to give you an idea of what to look for.

 

[bandit]

Testa,
Thanks for the reply. Syscon Servo is written on all of the circuit boards. I don't beleive that Sanyo is involved as I see no component parts other than Syscon Servo. At either rate, I tried accessing the files you mention at http://www.eserviceinfo.com/
Unfortunately, my computer can't access rar zip files. The load motor as no movement whatsoever. I remember pror to changing the belts, that once the unit is plugged in, that motor would spin briefly as if to reset itself. The fact that it has no movement at all to me would indicate that it is NOT receiving any power.

I have tried every conceivable timming combination and have exhausted all possible combinations. Perhaps it is afterall a power supply problem. What do you think?
Thanks,
The Bandit

 

[(*steve*)]

If you're using windows, 7-zip is a good program for handling rar files. Once installed (you may need to reboot) you can right click on these files and select "decompress here" (or something like that).

 

[Tesla]

If you run Windows, this should work:
http://www.izarc.org/

If the mech. isn't in home or idle position, it might not work like normal.

From what you have said so far, there really isn't any reason the power supply would go out if you just unplugged it and changed the belts.

The reason I think they might be the same is because of pages like these:
http://www.mainelectronics.com/prtsanyo.htm
http://www.servicemanuals.net/Sanyo.Fisher.sm.VCR.CAMCOR.html

Plus, I always got the impression that Fisher didn't really design and make anything themselves. I kinda thought someone make it for them cheaply, or they got OEM machines and just put their label on it ... not sure about that though.

 

[Tesla]

Here are free Sanyo 210 and 810 manuals:

http://www.jordansmanuals.com/default.aspx?Brand=Sanyo&Product=VCR

Don't buy this, but look at the cover:
http://home.comcast.net/~aa4df02/vhr9413a.htm

 

[Tesla]

Good site (not just for VCRs):
http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/sam/vcrfaq.htm#vcrmrivcrs

 

[jerryg50]

When you unplugged the VCR to service the belts, the power supply had no more power. It had the chance to cool down. Remember that even when the VCR is turned off, the power supply is always working because it has to run the clock, the memory, and the uPC.

Because of the age of the supply, there are more than likely a number of capacitors that are warn down, and are too far out of specs to allow the supply to start back up again.

The defective caps can be determined with an ESR meter. This is the easiest way to check for warn caps. Replace all the defective caps, and most likely the VCR should work again.

Warn caps from age is 90% of the fault in these units when they have aged.


Jerry G.

_________________________________

Hello everyone,
I have an old fisher VCR that won't power up. I am not sure if it is a "timing / alignment"
problem, or perhaps a power supply problem. The unit was working before I decided to replace the belts. After installing the new belts is when I encountered the power up problem. When I re-pluged the unit, it would not power on. The power button light comes on for about 5 seconds & then goes out. The LED display flashes but nothing else works.
I checked the fuse & ran a continuity test on it which showed the fuse is good.

Would appreciate anyone that can tell me the proper "timing / alignment" procedure. Also,
any suggestions if it's a power supply issue. There must be a reason why the unit will not power up. I am at wits end trying to figure out the cause of this.

Thank you !!
The Bandit

 

[Tesla]

Jerry,

Sure it could be the power supply, BUT since the original belt replacement:

The logic is getting some voltage (it's flashing 12:00).
The display filament is getting voltage (you can read it ... it is lit up).
The tape mech. is getting some voltage (because the cassette moved/loaded once).

... a good portion of the PS has to be working for those things to happen.

 

[bandit]

Hi guys. I finally was able to open that RAR. Followed timing procedure which matched what I had done. Therefore, as I said before IT IS NOT A TIMING problem for that loading motor not to work. It is the ONLY part on the VCR that wont work!! So, I tested it by removing it & running a few volts through it and it spun. A friend also tested the MODE switch for me & I was told it was good. Finally, I decided to trace the wires from the load motor which led me to a 12 pin IC. LB1649 which after a little research is known as a Sanyo BI-DIRECTIONAL MOTOR DRIVER. A part that costs $ 1.69. Interesting to say the least.
Just thought, I post it here to let you know. Thanks.
The Bandit

 

[Tesla]

Good to see you are still working on it.

If you are sure the mech. is working (motors, switches, sensors, timing, etc.) then I would move back to the power supply and make sure you are getting all your voltages. There should be an obvious output connector (that supplies various voltages to the rest of the VCR) where you can check them all.

One of those service manuals will come in handy. Even if the PS schematic doesn't match exactly, it will likely give you some idea how what to check for.

If the power supply checks out, then move on to the next inner boards (logic and the motor controller where that chip is).

 

[bandit]

Hi guys,
Everything in the unit seems to be working fine except for that one LOAD MOTOR. I am convinced that it is that specific IC LB1649 that has failed. I'll give you may reasons. Please bear in mind that I am a novice with very little electronic experience who is just using a little common sense here. Usually, when I plug the unit in, that particular motor would run for a few seconds & the main gear would move slightly as well as the mode switch, which I assume is all part of the unit checking itself for timing. I experimented a little and gave that LOAD MOTOR some gentle persuasion by moving the pulley back & forth which also slightly moved the main gear. Upon doing this, the power light stayed on. I was able to insert a cassette into the carriage which went in and down smoothly. I hit the play button and the LOAD MOTOR would not spin to turn the main gear. Then a few seconds later, the power light went off.

If it were a GENERAL POWER SUPPLY problem nothing would work. Of course I am not very experienced, but I think logically it has to be that IC, a bi-directional motor driver which has failed & thus not allowing any power to that specific LOAD MOTOR. There are two motors (Load Motor & Carriage Motor) on the unit which that IC controls. The real question in my mind is, if the IC is bad, shouldn't both motors be dead? Might there also be a nearby resistor that has failed that changes the wattage values too? What do you think?

That IC is a Sanyo Part which you were right on about Fisher & Sanyo being the same. Also, do you know of a SITE that is reasonably priced without minimum orders and expensive shipping charges? Hopefully, it will not be difficult to replace. It's a 12 pn IC. I think a 15W iron (not a 30W) ought to handle the job.

Thank you all so much for your time and your willingness to share your knowledge. It is greatly appreciated !!!
The Bandit

 

[Tesla]

Well, I didn't say it WAS the Power Supply (being bad) I said (if I was you) I would simply CHECK the Power Supply output voltages. There are many different voltages being outputted with various sub-circuits that work independently.

There should be a tape sensor. It's usually a light or LED. If that's not working, it might not try to load the tape into a playing position because it doesn't think the tape is there.

 

[bandit]

Tesla,
Of course you are right. It's just that I don't possess the knowledge & experience to test the output voltages that you mention. Although, I do have a multimeter which I only have used in a few automotive applications. What you mention in your previous post is above my skill level. Wish I knew how. To do that I would need to be guided step by step. That would be a time consuming post for you, and I dont want to impose on you or anyone else. And, of course I'd have many questions in between that would make this thread look like a book. So, for now I'll try replacing that IC and see what happens. If after, I do that and it still doesnt work, I'll wave the white flag of defeat. I'll post the results here.

Thank you for the time and troubleshooting ideas that you have given me that were right on the button. I am doing the best I can with the limited skills I have.

The Bandit

 

[bandit]

Hi Guys !!
I finally installed that IC (LB1649) that I suspected was bad. My VCR now works beautifully. Just like new !! Just thought I'd let you all know, and to express my thanks & appreciation for all of your replies !!
The Bandit

 

[Tesla]

Good work.

Where did you end up getting the chip from?

 

[(*steve*)]

I finally installed that IC (LB1649) that I suspected was bad. My VCR now works beautifully.

I haven't been following this thread in much detail recently, but good job in finding and fixing the problem.

In retrospect all of these problems seem obvious, but it almost never starts out that way