Are there simple line-powered MP3 recorders?

[Charlie E.]

Do you remember the Tascam model? Flash isn't ideal but a lot better
than CD or having to plug the whole device into a PC. That is because a
church member does the spooling onto the web from home and would then
have to drive back to church to return the unit.

Actually, we used the Tascam SS-CDR1 that does both compact Flash and
CD-R/RW recording. ( the contract required CDR, but I added the CF
capability.) It ran me about $900. There is also the Tascam SSR1
that just does CF for about $600. Also see a Marantz PMD560 CF
recorder for around $500. But, these are all pro grade machines, and
simple operation wasn't a design requirement! It is easy to mis-set
and get CD grade audio that fills up the memory very quickly, or mess
up the level settings and get nothing... :-(

Charllie

 

[Joerg]

I would use a computer. Did you read my posting some weeks ago?

http://groups.google.de/group/de.sci.electronics/msg/58b7c863b5257a33

Yes, we might just do that. Use a small laptop.

This would be most flexible, because you know: Once the client sees a first
version, they always have new ideas how it could be enhanced

Not in this area. I'd prefer to keep the sound booth as simple as
possible. Example from yesterday: The vicar turns his mike from mute to
active. Begins to speak. *WOOOOOOOOOO*.....

Humongous feedback, me dashing into the booth, none of the mixer pots
seemed to work. Vicar hastily turns his mike off. Luckily he's pretty
cool about this stuff. Turns out someone had set one of the tiny
potmeters on the side to almost full blast and forgot to set it to zero
later. The one for tape playback, and I had just started the recording.

And there are small and cheap PCs (e.g. thin clients, maybe you can get one
from ebay or an old laptop). Maybe you can even combine it with your
counseling service, that some parishioner can work on the software, to do
something useful, e.g. if unemployed etc.

Our IT guru does not want to have to maintain another PC but he said
he'd be ok with a laptop that isn't connected to anything but the mixer.
No LAN, no Internet. So yeah, the laptop idea is a good one. We might
try that out some time this week.

 

[[email protected]]

For our church we are looking for mains-powered (no batteries) MP3
recorders that can record up to 1.5hrs, preferably onto a USB stick. As
simple as possible, like on/off, record, stop.

Unfortunately that sounds like a MD recorder. "Unfortunately" because
Sony has put a lot of effort into keeping the format as brain dead as
possible.
You could score an old Hi-MD unit (1GB disc) on eBay, one with line-in
and a good microphone. These units have line in too.
I don't know what you are recording BTW.
The units support 16 bit, 44KHz PCM recording so you bypass the whole
ATRAC->MP3 transcoding.
They usually need a single AA battery and can last a long time even
recording. They also can use external power but this is an option you
need to select.
I think you'll end up with about the recording time you need.
These newer units connect to PCs.

Other solutions include a VCR. A good stereo Hi-Fi unit can record
great audio but you need to be careful with the dbx system in them.
(That's the system that gets rid of the head switching noise)
Bulky and slow. But cheap, and won't crash.

How about a nice, honking big reel to reel unit?

 

[Glenn Gundlach]

| For our church we are looking for mains-powered (no batteries) MP3
| recorders that can record up to 1.5hrs, preferably onto a USB stick.
As
| simple as possible, like on/off, record, stop.
|
| I have looked around the web and only found gear from Roland which had
| mixing functions and stuff that makes it too complicated, or Intempo
| which is more geared towards recording from radio channels and would
| probably need some hack to connect to our mixer. If this costs a few
| hundred Dollars that's ok but it cannot be complicated with teeny LCD
| screens and menus. In essence I'd have to be able to call someone and
| say "Turns this dark gray gizmo in the left corner on and hit the red
| record button", not explain a lengthy menu tree where they need a
| magnifier just to see it.
|
| IOW what we need is a cassette recorder sans cassettes, that records
| onto USB. Any ideas?
|
| --
| Regards, Joerg
|
| http://www.analogconsultants.com/
|
| "gmail" domain blocked because of excessive spam.
| Use another domain or send PM.

This is neat...
http://www.ikey-audio.com/ikey.htm

Cheers

Yeah it DOES look neat but claiming a 'reset' button as a 'feature'
doesn't inspire much confidence. 10 MB / minute (uncompressed .WAV) is
beyond USB 1.0 but not any problem for 2.0. Sure wouldn't take much of
a flash-drive to capture a few hours uncompressed CD quality.

GG

 

[Charlie E.]

Cool, thanks. He tries to keep his sermons to roughly 1/2hr. But we may
need longer recording times for special events such as a memorial
service. Relatives are really glad if they have a recording that
includes all the speeches and eulogies. It's usually the last thing
they've got to hang onto regarding the spouse or family member that
passed away. Other than the Pontiac GTO and stuff ...



If it survived that week it ought to be good.



I figured that. Nowadays I don't expect any audio designers to truly
understand diff-mode circuitry. Luckily Radio Shack has audio baluns,
hum eliminators, ground noise reducers or whatever is the current
marketing speak du jour for those. Now that's a 20 mile drive since our
local Radio Shack became <gasp> a cell phone shop.

When you need that hum eliminator, you probably won't find it at Radio
Shack. I needed one last week, and finally found one at Circuit City,
right after I ordered a couple on line at Amazon. BTW, when you need
one, look in the auto audio section...

Charlie

 

[Charlie E.]

Not in this area. I'd prefer to keep the sound booth as simple as
possible. Example from yesterday: The vicar turns his mike from mute to
active. Begins to speak. *WOOOOOOOOOO*.....

Humongous feedback, me dashing into the booth, none of the mixer pots
seemed to work. Vicar hastily turns his mike off. Luckily he's pretty
cool about this stuff. Turns out someone had set one of the tiny
potmeters on the side to almost full blast and forgot to set it to zero
later. The one for tape playback, and I had just started the recording.

Yeah, I hate that! Had an argument with a guy at Tascam, because the
'tape monitor' feature is a real PITA! Sure, it is nice in some
configurations, but if you want to have a non-operator setup, and
still use the tape (or CDR) for playing as well as recording, then you
get feedback up the ying-yang! You have to set you record levels low,
and your playback levels low so that you get an overal loss of at
least 10dB in the loop. They really need to have a 'disable monitor'
option in there...

Charlie

 

[Charlie E.]

Thanks. Still needs a wall wart and SD cards (no USB sticks) but if it
has your endorsement maybe we can get a real power supply for it.

Question: It says "recording time can be extended with a SD card". It is
possible to record only onto the SD cards and not at all into the
device's memory? Someone needs to take it home and they should not have
to take the whole device because it may be needed again soon after.

Hmmm...

Ok, you can record either to the internal memory, or to an SD card.
However, I don't see an aux in jack on it to connect to a PA system,
just uses its own mikes. Probably not!

Charlie

 

[David L. Jones]

For our church we are looking for mains-powered (no batteries) MP3
recorders that can record up to 1.5hrs, preferably onto a USB stick. As
simple as possible, like on/off, record, stop.

I have looked around the web and only found gear from Roland which had
mixing functions and stuff that makes it too complicated, or Intempo which
is more geared towards recording from radio channels and would probably
need some hack to connect to our mixer. If this costs a few hundred
Dollars that's ok but it cannot be complicated with teeny LCD screens and
menus. In essence I'd have to be able to call someone and say "Turns this
dark gray gizmo in the left corner on and hit the red record button", not
explain a lengthy menu tree where they need a magnifier just to see it.

IOW what we need is a cassette recorder sans cassettes, that records onto
USB. Any ideas?

What about this Philips unit:
http://www.voicex.com.au/Brochures/Philips/Philips LFH9750.pdf
SD card storage, but SD to USB stick converters are a dime a dozen.

Dave.

 

[mpm]

Do you remember the Tascam model? Flash isn't ideal but a lot better
than CD or having to plug the whole device into a PC. That is because a
church member does the spooling onto the web from home and would then
have to drive back to church to return the unit.

- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

What (interface) do you use to put your church service audio up on the
web?
Just MP3 files attached to a click button, or something more
elaborate?
I have a similar project in the works at our church...

Right now, we just have archived audio available for downloading, and
a live Internet streaming.

-mpm

 

[Adrian C]

True, OTOH my 12V adapter from the Timex Sinclair ZX81 from the early 1980
has been on 24/7 with original parts and is still working fine.
That makes > 25 years.

So what are you doing with a _ZX81_ running on for 25 years?

Is it trapped in an application running a nuclear power plant by any chance?

<http://ganjatron.net/retrocomputing/zx81/index.html>

 

[Joerg]

What (interface) do you use to put your church service audio up on the
web?

Currently I record on audio cassettes and then another member uses a PC
to create MP3 from that:

https://loth.ctsmemberconnect.net/sermon-ctrl.do

Unfortunately it's now through this 3rd party site and it doesn't work
on all PCs. The audio is also very distorted because of some wrong
setting. Recording directly to MP3 so I can check it right after the
service should fix that, plus save time when placing it on the web.

Just MP3 files attached to a click button, or something more
elaborate?

Yep. It used to work on every PC but not anymore :-(

I have a similar project in the works at our church...

Right now, we just have archived audio available for downloading, and
a live Internet streaming.

We want to try an old laptop this week. If you try that you'll
definitely need an audio balun, else the noise from its power brick is
going to be terrible. BTDT.

 

[Joerg]

When you need that hum eliminator, you probably won't find it at Radio
Shack. I needed one last week, and finally found one at Circuit City,
right after I ordered a couple on line at Amazon. BTW, when you need
one, look in the auto audio section...

Yep, that's one place where I got them when I urgently needed one at a
client: The local auto parts store.

Radio Shack used to have some but the in-store stuff is now often
reduced to plain old consumer gear. Sad.

 

[Joerg]

No, it has both line and mic inputs as well as its internal mics.

Probably one of those dreaded plastic-jacketed 3.5mm stereo jacks that
are known for intermittent connections :-(

A lot of times I had to use a rubber band to pull the plug to the side
so the audio wouldn't crackle.

 

[Joerg]

Yeah, I hate that! Had an argument with a guy at Tascam, because the
'tape monitor' feature is a real PITA! Sure, it is nice in some
configurations, but if you want to have a non-operator setup, and
still use the tape (or CDR) for playing as well as recording, then you
get feedback up the ying-yang! You have to set you record levels low,
and your playback levels low so that you get an overal loss of at
least 10dB in the loop. They really need to have a 'disable monitor'
option in there...

In the old days this was simple: Philips screw driver, lift off lid,
snip, done ;-)

 

[Joerg]

That only makes it worse, as it bends the contacts away.

It's the usual. The ugliest kludges have a habit of working fine for
decades. Once it works, don't touch it ;-)

Better solder on some wire and use a decent external connector,
if you cannot replace the bad one.
And use gold plated contacts.

Only if it is a real connector, not a 3.5mm stereo jack. The minimum
would be a 1/4" (6.3mm) jack, anything smaller would need the right
incantations to work reliably.

 

[Joerg]

Unfortunately that sounds like a MD recorder. "Unfortunately" because
Sony has put a lot of effort into keeping the format as brain dead as
possible.
You could score an old Hi-MD unit (1GB disc) on eBay, one with line-in
and a good microphone. These units have line in too.

We have that here at home. But MD is a dying format.

I don't know what you are recording BTW.

The sermon at church, roughly 30mins. Plus occasionally a complete
memorial service which can be 1.5hrs.

The units support 16 bit, 44KHz PCM recording so you bypass the whole
ATRAC->MP3 transcoding.
They usually need a single AA battery and can last a long time even
recording. They also can use external power but this is an option you
need to select.
I think you'll end up with about the recording time you need.
These newer units connect to PCs.

Batteries are a big no-no at church unless absolutely needed. They leak,
they are depleted just at the wrong time, just not practical. Best is a
simple power connection. Why use batteries when 120V is right there?

Other solutions include a VCR. A good stereo Hi-Fi unit can record
great audio but you need to be careful with the dbx system in them.
(That's the system that gets rid of the head switching noise)
Bulky and slow. But cheap, and won't crash.

Oh, they do crash, just differently. Rat-tat-tat-*CLUNK*. Then you have
to surgically remove oodles of mangled tape. BTDT.

How about a nice, honking big reel to reel unit?

Yeah, that would have the real retro-feel

Or maybe Edison's drum recorder ...

 

[Spehro Pefhany]

For our church we are looking for mains-powered (no batteries) MP3
recorders that can record up to 1.5hrs, preferably onto a USB stick. As
simple as possible, like on/off, record, stop.

I have looked around the web and only found gear from Roland which had
mixing functions and stuff that makes it too complicated, or Intempo
which is more geared towards recording from radio channels and would
probably need some hack to connect to our mixer. If this costs a few
hundred Dollars that's ok but it cannot be complicated with teeny LCD
screens and menus. In essence I'd have to be able to call someone and
say "Turns this dark gray gizmo in the left corner on and hit the red
record button", not explain a lengthy menu tree where they need a
magnifier just to see it.

IOW what we need is a cassette recorder sans cassettes, that records
onto USB. Any ideas?

This one looks a bit dubious but it appears to be aimed at your sort
of application (uses SD cards).

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/492073-REG/Rolls_HR73_HR73_Rack_Mount.html
Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany

 

[Joerg]

I have some all metal external (cable) female 3.5 mm connectors that have worked
OK for years.

I do, too. But the plastic stuff that you find embedded in many of those
audio gizmos is usually the same low grade as on PC sound cards.

Else the metal DIN 3 or 5 pole are very reliable.

Sure. But totally unknown in America. So, before moving to the US I
bought a bunch of them in Europe because our old Saba stereo has those.
Also the Philips Gamma tube set (remember those?).

 

[Joerg]

This one looks a bit dubious but it appears to be aimed at your sort
of application (uses SD cards).

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/492073-REG/Rolls_HR73_HR73_Rack_Mount.html

Aha! Thanks. Rackmount is even better. I just wonder what they mean by
power supply, a wall wart or something a notch better. I'll show this to
the guys at church, if they want it I'll find out whether this recorder
can ignore the internal flash and go straight to removeable memory, and
what kind the supply is.

 

[Joerg]

On a sunny day (Tue, 28 Oct 2008 11:05:45 -0700) it happened Joerg
[...]

Also the Philips Gamma tube set (remember those?).

Sorry, typo, it's the Philips Gemma:

http://www.kofferradios.de/rr/ph/ph060.html

No, but I remember the Philips Plano, I liked those models:
http://people.cs.uu.nl/gerard/RadioCorner/Sets/Phil543.htm
Note the EM80 cat eye.
http://www.elwins-radiopage.demon.nl/radios/b4x23.htm

Way too modern in the design of it's enclosure ;-)