Wandering Tracking on Old Beta VCR

[Chris F.]

With Beta VCR's going for big bucks on Ebay (at least if in good working
order) I thought it might be worth fixing up and selling some of the ones
I've kept in storage for just such an occasion. Some aren't going to be easy
though, and here's one I'm going to need some advice on.
It's a Sanyo VCR-4500, and the problem is that the tracking slowly and
constantly wanders back and forth. I tried tweaking some of the adjustments
on the servo board, but still could not completely stabilize it. I admit my
knowledge of VCR's is somewhat lacking; I never fully grasped the concept of
servos and PG systems and much of the other complicated circuitury. I can
only guess that some reference signal is drifting in frequency, but that's
about as fancy a theory as I can come up with.
I thoroughly checked the power supply and all voltages are rock-solid. I
noticed that the capstan supply voltage, specified as 12VDC in the manual,
only measures 11.6, not sure if that would affect anything or not. I also
tried swapping the capstan motor from a known-good machine but that didn't
make any difference.
It's worth noting that the unit was working fine when I first acquired it,
some six or seven years ago, and it has been in cold storage ever since.
Maybe some bad caps?
Thanks for any advice.

 

[b]

the problem is that the tracking slowly and
constantly wanders back and forth. I tried tweaking some of the adjustments
on the servo board, but still could not completely stabilize it.

AAAARRRGGGHH! the phantom twiddler! A pet hate of all techs! I HOPE
you marked the original positions of those pots.....

I admit my

knowledge of VCR's is somewhat lacking; I never fully grasped the concept of
servos and PG systems and much of the other complicated circuitury.

....and still you hope to refurb and resell these beasts? I would
forget it if I were you.

I can

only guess that some reference signal is drifting in frequency, but that's
about as fancy a theory as I can come up with.

.....that is not even a theory, that is pure guesswork. have you
checked the A/c head? pinch roller? tape path? torque? consumer
tracking adjust pot condition?all of these are fundamentals and well
known causes for this problem....

B.

 

[Bruce Esquibel]

....that is not even a theory, that is pure guesswork. have you
checked the A/c head? pinch roller? tape path? torque? consumer
tracking adjust pot condition?all of these are fundamentals and well
known causes for this problem....

Off hand I think the guy is better off just trying to sell it off "as-is".

If it's that series of Sanyo I'm thinking of, those were barely repairable
20 years ago.

The main problem with it, it's 100% plastic, everything, the well the
transport sits in, the load rings, arms, gears, levers.

Those machines were introduced to be price competitive by being built as
cheap as possible to try to get a gain on vhs sales. Other brands like Sony
and Toshiba may have been cheaping down, but were smart enough to leave some
metal where it was needed (like on the transport).

Although his problem might be electrical, there was a re-occurance of a
small cap (either 1uf or 3.3uf) on the pulse line coming from the capstan
motor for one of the servo circuits, more likely the machine is just plain
warped.

No joke, I saw one so bad it was visible by just eyeballing. The guy who
owned it had it on top of the tv and likely between the heat from the
machine and what was coming out the vents of the set just warped the chassis
in under a year or so.

If you got the tape to load, more or less the same results, looked like some
kind of tracking error, enough to be annoying. But I'm telling you, there
wasn't a damn thing wrong with it except mechanical alignment which wasn't
possible anymore.

Just sell it as-is, I really don't think a Sanyo four-thousand series is
worth anything, even in mint condition.

-bruce
[email protected]

 

[Chris F.]

No need to insult my intelligence - I'm not quite as ignorant as you
think.
All components in the tape path are fine. I did however try changing a few
capacitors in the tracking and PG amplifier circuits, and it appears to have
done the trick. With a bit more tweaking I was able to get a good stable
picture at both speeds.

 

[Chris F.]

Just sell it as-is, I really don't think a Sanyo four-thousand series is
worth anything, even in mint condition.

Well, I got just over $200 US for a 6310 the other night.... if all Sanyos
are worth even half that, it's well worth putting some time and money into
them.

 

[Roy]

Well, I got just over $200 US for a 6310 the other night.... if all Sanyos
are worth even half that, it's well worth putting some time and money into
them.

Wow! I think I have a couple of 5000's in my loft somewhere...I am rich!!
;0)
Roy

 

[[email protected]]

Well, I got just over $200 US for a 6310 the other night.... if all Sanyos
are worth even half that, it's well worth putting some time and money into
them.

Have you changed the pinch roller and all belts? Tracking will try to
follow the varying speed of the tape passing the read heads, and if
you have an old roller and belt(s), "that have been sitting in storage
for years", then you will have tracking problems.
tom

 

[Bruce Esquibel]

Well, I got just over $200 US for a 6310 the other night.... if all Sanyos
are worth even half that, it's well worth putting some time and money into
them.

I have to admit I'm sort of stumped. Looking at completed auctions on ebay
most Sony models, even those with the hi-fi audio don't seem to fetch more
than $75-$100 for most of the mid-level machines.

Why the Sanyo's seem to be getting more is an oddity.

Another thing to admit, looking at the picture of the Sanyo 4000, that isn't
the chassis I was thinking of, I think.

-bruce
[email protected]

 

[Roy]

I have to admit I'm sort of stumped. Looking at completed auctions on ebay
most Sony models, even those with the hi-fi audio don't seem to fetch more
than $75-$100 for most of the mid-level machines.

Why the Sanyo's seem to be getting more is an oddity.

Another thing to admit, looking at the picture of the Sanyo 4000, that
isn't
the chassis I was thinking of, I think.

-bruce
[email protected]

I used to be a Sanyo dealer and I loved them! Everything easy to get at and
(mostly) easily repaired when required. Sony on the other hand were a pain
in the A**e. Parts were as expensive as hell and service anuals also. Faults
were always really obscure and circuitry was weird and super critical. I
would rather have a Sanyo any day. As a matter of fact, I still have a Sanyo
CRT TV giving as good a picture as good as when I took it home 20 odd years
ago!

Roy

 

[b]

I have to admit I'm sort of stumped. Looking at completed auctions on ebay
most Sony models, even those with the hi-fi audio don't seem to fetch more
than $75-$100 for most of the mid-level machines.

Why the Sanyo's seem to be getting more is an oddity.

Simple. the sanyos unlaced the tape from the head during rewind, which
helped save on wear. they were lighter and are as such easier to mail
than sony. They are easy to access mechanically.
Sony , as Roy says, were expensive and awkward to service , bulkier,
and suffer from head wear (I have had at least 6 c-30 betas pass
through my hands with useless heads, not one single sanyo with this
problem ever). Same goes for the unusually complicated cassette front
loading mech which always seems to break. All that makes them
generally a worse used buy. (and I have a C9 and 3 HF-100s!)

-B

 

[Jeroni Paul]

I have a Sony C-20 in working condition. As an anecdote many years ago
I was testing it while I was trying to find the code for an universal
remote control. Went through all the codes using the remote autosearch
feature while pointing it to the VCR without any success until I
realized the machine did not appear to have any IR receiver window.
Felt pretty stupid for that...

 

[Mark Zacharias]

Well, I beg to differ with ALMOST everyone here. The SANYO beta
machines were by FAR the BEST beta machines ever on the CONSUMER
market. Inexpensive, reliable, easy to work on and most problems could
be fixed for less than $100 Canadian. The others (Sony and their
re-branded offspring being the WORST) were by and large radically
overpriced JUNK, unreliable, a pain to work on,expensive parts and
don't get me started about parts availabilty.
A Sony typically cost $150+ Canadian to repair and that was just the
parts !

Oh, BTW the ' wander tracking ' was usually (99.99999 % ) caused by a
defunct capstan motor. Good luck finding one of THOSE these days.

Pardon my pro-SANYO rant but I serviced 'em for many years both in and
out of warranty so I am obviously BIASED.


Kevin

Sanyo's were much worse about eating tapes, I can tell you that. If one was
an authorized Sony servicer and was familiar with the product, repairs
weren't so difficult. Further, Sony's were worth more from the start, and
customers were generally willing to spend more to fix them.

Mark Z.

 

[b]

I have a Sony C-20 in working condition. As an anecdote many years ago
I was testing it while I was trying to find the code for an universal
remote control. Went through all the codes using the remote autosearch
feature while pointing it to the VCR without any success until I
realized the machine did not appear to have any IR receiver window.
Felt pretty stupid for that...

we've all been there, I'm sure!
yes, the c20 was the basic version of the c30.
-B

 

[Kevin Dooks]

With Beta VCR's going for big bucks on Ebay (at least if in good working
order) I thought it might be worth fixing up and selling some of the ones
I've kept in storage for just such an occasion. Some aren't going to be easy
though, and here's one I'm going to need some advice on.
It's a Sanyo VCR-4500, and the problem is that the tracking slowly and
constantly wanders back and forth. I tried tweaking some of the adjustments
on the servo board, but still could not completely stabilize it. I admit my
knowledge of VCR's is somewhat lacking; I never fully grasped the concept of
servos and PG systems and much of the other complicated circuitury. I can
only guess that some reference signal is drifting in frequency, but that's
about as fancy a theory as I can come up with.
I thoroughly checked the power supply and all voltages are rock-solid. I
noticed that the capstan supply voltage, specified as 12VDC in the manual,
only measures 11.6, not sure if that would affect anything or not. I also
tried swapping the capstan motor from a known-good machine but that didn't
make any difference.
It's worth noting that the unit was working fine when I first acquired it,
some six or seven years ago, and it has been in cold storage ever since.
Maybe some bad caps?
Thanks for any advice.

Well, I beg to differ with ALMOST everyone here. The SANYO beta
machines were by FAR the BEST beta machines ever on the CONSUMER
market. Inexpensive, reliable, easy to work on and most problems could
be fixed for less than $100 Canadian. The others (Sony and their
re-branded offspring being the WORST) were by and large radically
overpriced JUNK, unreliable, a pain to work on,expensive parts and
don't get me started about parts availabilty.
A Sony typically cost $150+ Canadian to repair and that was just the
parts !

Oh, BTW the ' wander tracking ' was usually (99.99999 % ) caused by a
defunct capstan motor. Good luck finding one of THOSE these days.

Pardon my pro-SANYO rant but I serviced 'em for many years both in and
out of warranty so I am obviously BIASED.


Kevin

 

[Chris F.]

Oh, BTW the ' wander tracking ' was usually (99.99999 % ) caused by a
defunct capstan motor. Good luck finding one of THOSE these days.

As I said in my original post, I swapped the capstan motor with one from a
good-working unit, and it made no difference.....

 

[b]

No need to insult my intelligence - I'm not quite as ignorant as you
think.
All components in the tape path are fine. I did however try changing a few
capacitors in the tracking and PG amplifier circuits, and it appears to have
done the trick. With a bit more tweaking I was able to get a good stable
picture at both speeds.

sorry if I came across as insulting, one reads all kinds of things on
here and sometimes posts don't convey the OPs real knowledge ...
anyway glad to hear you got some progress. However, often, making pot
adjustments can mask the real, underlying mechanical or electrical
fault, so do bear that in mind to avoid disappointment!

-B