LCD Screens. Zero Pixel Warranties....

[Running Through The Forest]

Bloody hell it's like getting blood out of a stone

In my quest to buy a flat panel screen for my PC I have never heard so much
double talk. OK didn't shop around much because here in SA there ain't
an awful lot of decent stores to shop in for computer stuff....

First port of call was Radio Rentals and they flat out refused to hop on the topic
of a "zero dead pixels" warranty for any of the LCD stuff they sell.

Next port of call was a shop in Tea Tree Plaza where I found some more screens
to look at. Even they couldn't say anything more about pixel warranties.

Why is it such a touchy topic?

Surely if the screen has dead pixels it's not fit for the purpose it was intended. so why
is it so topical?

 

[Jackie]

If you have access to APC magazine, just recently they had an issue that
covered this topic in detail.

A search on their website may even reveal the article.

Basically don't be bluffed by stores. If you purchase a unit and it
develops a dead pixel, you have every right to return it regardless of
what the seller says!

Jackie

 

[DalienX]

Bloody hell it's like getting blood out of a stone

In my quest to buy a flat panel screen for my PC I have never heard
so much double talk. OK didn't shop around much because here in SA
there ain't an awful lot of decent stores to shop in for computer
stuff....

First port of call was Radio Rentals and they flat out refused to hop
on the topic of a "zero dead pixels" warranty for any of the LCD
stuff they sell.

Next port of call was a shop in Tea Tree Plaza where I found some
more screens to look at. Even they couldn't say anything more about
pixel warranties.

Why is it such a touchy topic?

Surely if the screen has dead pixels it's not fit for the purpose it
was intended. so why is it so topical?

i would consider dead pixels to be coverd in the standard warranty. the
bit about "defective manufacturing" should it.

Ive never even seen an lcd screen with a dead pixle, except one on a
laptop i know had been dropped, and dead pixles were the least of its
problems..

 

[Richard]

Why is it such a touchy topic?

If manufacturers rejected monitors with at least one dead pixels then
a lot of monitors would get rejected and the price for what is already
an expensive item would be a lot higher.

 

[Lord-Data]

Because its not the retailers problem?
The specifics of it all is by the manufacturers .. buy from someone with a
satisfaction policy .. Officeworks, for example, has a 30 day return policy,
regardless of what the reason .. I'd imagine a lot of others do too ..

Sony has a high series display line which comes with a 0 dead pixel waranty,
but of course, you pay for the privilage.

Like otherwise mentioned, the LCD manurfacturing process is rather
expensive, and very prone to pixel failures. While a lot of money and time
has been invested in improving the process, there are always going to be
undetected failures.. The extra screening processes drive the costs up
significantly .. so if you want a 100% garuntee of 0 dead pixels, pay for a
high series Sony monitor (X series?) and be happy ..

 

[thegoons]

SOme of the higher-end Sony monitors do have zero dead pixel guarantees.
Harris Technology website http://www.ht.com.au gives some details in the
description text for the higher-end Sony monitors about zero dead pixel
policies.

However, if you specifically tell a retailer that you specifically require
your monitor to have zero dead pixels, then for the lifetime of the
wanrranty you should be able to take it back. In reality, this is going to
be near impossible, however if you had the patience to follow up with your
local consumer affairs authority or small claims/consumer affairs
tribunal/court, then they would
likely find in your favour if you explained that the goods were "not as
described" and "unfit for the purpose intended". You had also relied on the
salesman's professional skills/judgment to offer that product based on your
request.

 

[Rudolf Ladyzhenskii]

Hi,

I have seen LCD's with dead pixels. Cheaper ones. Recent was a 15" ACER with
bright dot in the middle of the screen.

Viewsonic used to make V520 and V720 (15" and 17" respectively) with 0 dead
pixels warranty.
Samsung is selling monitors with 7-days 0 bad pixels warranty.

I prefer Mitsubishi monitors and sold quite a few of 15" and 17" ones -- all
turned out to be free of bad pixels, even so Misthubishi does not
guarrantees it.

I own a DV175 -- great monitor. Sold about 5 of this model so far -- all
were OK.

Rudolf

 

[Krusty]

Bloody hell it's like getting blood out of a stone

In my quest to buy a flat panel screen for my PC I have never heard so
much double talk. OK didn't shop around much because here in SA
there ain't an awful lot of decent stores to shop in for computer
stuff....

First port of call was Radio Rentals and they flat out refused to hop
on the topic of a "zero dead pixels" warranty for any of the LCD
stuff they sell.

Next port of call was a shop in Tea Tree Plaza where I found some
more screens to look at. Even they couldn't say anything more about
pixel warranties.

Why is it such a touchy topic?

Surely if the screen has dead pixels it's not fit for the purpose it
was intended. so why is it so topical?

DICKHEAD

 

[DalienX]

Hi,

I have seen LCD's with dead pixels. Cheaper ones. Recent was a 15"
ACER with bright dot in the middle of the screen.

acer? cheap? i paid $700 for my 15 inch acer. wouldnt exactly call that
cheap. oh and mine doesn't have any dead pixels.

 

[Rudolf Ladyzhenskii]

acer? cheap? i paid $700 for my 15 inch acer. wouldnt exactly call that

cheap. oh and mine doesn't have any dead pixels.

Mitsubishi cost about $30-$40 more. Getting a "cheap" one does necessarily
mean there will be dead pixels, although chances are higher than with more
expensive ones.

BTW, I should have the stock of VERY GOOD LCD monitors soon (I am waiting
for info from USA). Those wil have AV inputs and picture quality is much
higher than of normal consumer grade monitors. Price, unfortunately, is
higher too. I will post more info when I have it.

Rudolf

 

[Running Through The Forest]

If you have access to APC magazine, just recently they had an issue that
covered this topic in detail.

A search on their website may even reveal the article.

Basically don't be bluffed by stores. If you purchase a unit and it
develops a dead pixel, you have every right to return it regardless of
what the seller says!

Jackie

I shall do a google.


Do you know which month of APC it was?






John

 

[Running Through The Forest]

SOme of the higher-end Sony monitors do have zero dead pixel guarantees.
Harris Technology website http://www.ht.com.au gives some details in the
description text for the higher-end Sony monitors about zero dead pixel
policies.

However, if you specifically tell a retailer that you specifically require
your monitor to have zero dead pixels, then for the lifetime of the
wanrranty you should be able to take it back. In reality, this is going to
be near impossible, however if you had the patience to follow up with your
local consumer affairs authority or small claims/consumer affairs
tribunal/court, then they would
likely find in your favour if you explained that the goods were "not as
described" and "unfit for the purpose intended". You had also relied on the
salesman's professional skills/judgment to offer that product based on your
request.

Actually they've left it up to me to search out the policies for the
brands that they sell which is quite odd if you ask me..... I am
buying a BenQ.

The demo one seemed OK had no bad spots and I will plug this
one in at the store before I take it home.

 

[Running Through The Forest]

DICKHEAD

Well that was mature

 

[Running Through The Forest]

I was under the impression that LCD monitors slowly drop pixels over
their lifetime until there are so many that you don't want to use it
anymore and you go buy a new one. I have a 19" Mitsubishi CRT at home,
works great, I use a 22" Dell LCD at work and I prefer the CRT, better
picture. I know all the hype about LCD and how cool they are but in my
opinion the quality just is not there yet. The LCD I use at work started
dropping pixels after about 8 days, has about 10 now (6months later). I
used to live in Adelaide so I know what you are up against. If I recall
correctly Mitsubishi's have 3 years warranty. If you are concerned find
out where the nearest repair centre's are and go in and ask them
questions about which monitors stuff up the most and which one's have
the least fuss warranty. If you find that you can buy from anywhere and
take for repairs to a local repair centre if the unfortunate happens
then you are on a good thing.

As I mentioned in another reply it's a very interesting topic this.

The store has more or less said to me that I should be searching out
the manufacturers policy on the net which I found rather odd, since if
I have any problems I will be marching back there with the screen in
order to fix it.

Strange policy indeed.

 

[Lord-Data]

LG L1800P 18" here .. much better pic quality than my old 17" Diamond View
... I guess i've gone from a cheapy CRT to a high end LCD, but its a VERY
nice monitor with brilliant picture quality .. bought this one ex-display
from work so i know it has no dead pixels (got to thoroughly inspect it
prior to purchase) .. I think LGs warantee on pixels is > 1 dead pixel in
center area (so 1 only does not count), or 3 outside center area.. but its
all good for me ..

And I do not believe LCDs develop dead pixels .. they are 90% of the time a
manurfacturing process side effect.. LCDs usually only develop dead pixels
due to damage.. ie, a major impact or drop.

Also, most dead pixels people see are not true dead pixels, but dead
sub-pixels, which often are defined even further in warantys.. a dead
sub-pixel is usually seen as a pixel that wont go a particular colour, or
stays a particular colour on certain backgrounds .. ie, when the screen is
most colours you can't see it, but when its black it stays red, or something
... my nokia 6600 has one dead sub pixel .. behaves this way .. when the
screen around it is black (or i guess, more correctly, when it is meant to
be black), it glows red .. slightly distracting, but i'm used to it now

It'd be the ones that glow a colour when theyr meant to be white that would
be the worst .. a single bright red pixel on a white background would be
really annoying

 

[Running Through The Forest]

What about pixels that stay black and just will not change?

Wouldn't that be more of a problem especially near the centre?

 

[Fred]

Acouple of links that may be of interest:

BenQ Australia LCD Monitors: LCD Defect Policy
http://www.benq.com.au/Doc/LCD Monitor Pixel Policy.pdf


"Customers and retailers are uniting against shoddy "dead pixel" policies,
forcing change on monitor and notebook makers with poor standards and even
worse customer service"
http://www.apcmag.com/apc/v3.nsf/0/3E436FCD71738DC7CA256E3800076FBE

 

[Lord-Data]

thats usually an actual "Dead pixel" .. a dead pixel is when a pixel wont do
anythign ..

a dad subpixel is when it affects only one of the 3 small pixles that make
up a pixel ..

most proper "dead pixels" are black ..

warantys usually cover 1 or 2 dead pixels, but needs to be 4 or 5 dead sub
pixels to be equiv..

 

[Running Through The Forest]

From the BenQ web site

BenQ Australia

LCD Monitors: LCD Defect Policy
----------------------------------
Due to the cost of producing LCD panels, panel manufacturers
have set limits as to how many defective dots (or sub-pixels)
are deemed to be acceptable for a standard LCD panel. The goal
in setting such limits is to maintain a reasonable price of the
panel while minimizing distraction from defective dots.


What is a Bright and or a Dark Dot?
----------------------------------
A pixel (picture element) consists of one red and one green and
one blue dot or sub pixel. A standard 15" LCD panel with a resolution
of 1024 x 768 pixels has a total of 786,432 pixels or 2,359,296 dots.
17", 18.i" or 19" LCD panels have almost 4 million dots, while a
20.1" LCD has more than 5.5 million dots.

Each dot is driven by an individual transistor. If a transistor becomes
defective, the corresponding dot may be permanently lit (a bright dot)
or may not light (a dark dot). For a manufacturer to guarantee that all
LCD panels are totally defect free would lead to a much higher cost of
manufacture.

Defective Pixel Specifications

1. Total Defective Dots
The specifications for the number of defects that are deemed to be
acceptable for each size of LCD panel are:

LCD Panel Size Maximum Number of Maximum Number Total Dots
Bright Dots Dark Dots (Maximum)
15"/38.1 cm 2 3 5
17"/43.2cm 3 4 7
18.1"/46cm 4 4 9
19"/48.3cm 4 5 9
20.1"/51.lcm 5 5 10





2. No Bright Dots in the Central Area of the LCD Panel.
-------------------------------------------------------
The central third (1/3) bright dots area of the BenQ LCD panel is
as illustrated below, taking up one of the height and width of the
panel (one ninth of the area). No may occur in this area. * Please
note that the FP767 ver2 white/red and the FP791 have a no bright
dot policy for the 1st
year*

_________________________________________________________
| | | |
| | | |
| 1/9 | 1/9 | 1/9 |
| | | |
|________________|______________________|_______________|
| | | |
| | No Bright | |
| 1/9 | In This | 1/9 |
| | Area | |
|________________|______________________|_______________|
| | | |
| | | |
| 1/9 | 1/9 | 1/9 |
| | | |
|________________|______________________|_______________|


* Please note that the FP767 ver2 white/red and the FP791 have a
no bright dot policy for the 1st year*



LCD Monitor Pixel Spec. Revision 3, 12’~ March. 2004

 

[Alex Gibson]

I was under the impression that LCD monitors slowly drop pixels over
their lifetime until there are so many that you don't want to use it
anymore and you go buy a new one. I have a 19" Mitsubishi CRT at home,
works great, I use a 22" Dell LCD at work and I prefer the CRT, better
picture. I know all the hype about LCD and how cool they are but in my
opinion the quality just is not there yet. The LCD I use at work started
dropping pixels after about 8 days, has about 10 now (6months later). I
used to live in Adelaide so I know what you are up against. If I recall
correctly Mitsubishi's have 3 years warranty. If you are concerned find
out where the nearest repair centre's are and go in and ask them
questions about which monitors stuff up the most and which one's have
the least fuss warranty. If you find that you can buy from anywhere and
take for repairs to a local repair centre if the unfortunate happens
then you are on a good thing.

If you have good eye sight, it might not be a big deal.
For me(and those with glasses) it is a big deal, using an lcd has completely
got rid of eyestrain, and if I need to can sit in front of the monitor for
more than eight hours without
headaches or other problems.

Quality ? Don't know I've only ever used Samsung.

I've been using lcds at home for three years and wouldn't go back.
They are also great if you don't have much space.

The Samsung 171MP I've used for nearly three years hasn't got a
single dead pixel yet.
The Samsung 171s I have also doesn't have any dead pixels but the screen
doesn't give as good contrast or brightness as the 171MP.

Alex