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Installing alarm system on a 'prewired' house

Z

Zen

Hello,

My house had the alarm 'prewire' option and most windows and doors have
a magnetic contact in them. Also, in one of the closets near the
entrance, there is a bunch of wires and 2 power outlets.

In the closet, there are 7 white wires, 7 slight thicker gray wires and
1 green and 1 blue wire. I'm trying to figure out what these wires are.
My guess is that there are 7 white and 7 gray wires because the house
has 7 hardwired zones and the green wire is for the keypad and blue
wire is phone line. Can anyone tell me what these wires are? Also, I
couldn't find wires for a keypad anywhere else in the house. Does that
mean I'll have to install the keypad inside the closet next to the
panel or should I extend the cable for the keypad so it can be
installed elsewhere?

I'm considering buying a Ademco Vista-20PS with the 6270 graphic keypad
and installing it myself, hopefully it won't be that hard.

Any information would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.
 
F

Frank Olson

Zen said:
Hello,

My house had the alarm 'prewire' option and most windows and doors have
a magnetic contact in them. Also, in one of the closets near the
entrance, there is a bunch of wires and 2 power outlets.

In the closet, there are 7 white wires, 7 slight thicker gray wires and
1 green and 1 blue wire. I'm trying to figure out what these wires are.
My guess is that there are 7 white and 7 gray wires because the house
has 7 hardwired zones and the green wire is for the keypad and blue
wire is phone line. Can anyone tell me what these wires are? Also, I
couldn't find wires for a keypad anywhere else in the house. Does that
mean I'll have to install the keypad inside the closet next to the
panel or should I extend the cable for the keypad so it can be
installed elsewhere?

I'm considering buying a Ademco Vista-20PS with the 6270 graphic keypad
and installing it myself, hopefully it won't be that hard.

Any information would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.
Click to expand...


Do you know the name of the installing company responsible for the
pre-wire? Wire jacket colors don't tell you much. The easiest way to
determine what the wires are are to "tone them out", but since it's
likely you don't have a tone set, you're going to have to rely on the
old multi-meter (you'll need access to *both* ends of the wire though).

You should have a keypad wire somewhere (it's probably four or six
conductor and more than likely located above a light switch). If it's
actually buried (and it sounds like it is), the only way to find it will
be with the aforementioned tone set. If you don't know the name of the
installing company, call around and find a friendly local alarmco. Pay
the guy two hours to label all the wires. It'll be well worth the $100
or so dollars it's going to cost you. Chances are he'll give you a deal
on the complete system too, but that's jumping the gun so to speak... :)
 
F

Frank Olson

Zen said:
Hello,

My house had the alarm 'prewire' option and most windows and doors have
a magnetic contact in them. Also, in one of the closets near the
entrance, there is a bunch of wires and 2 power outlets.

In the closet, there are 7 white wires, 7 slight thicker gray wires and
1 green and 1 blue wire. I'm trying to figure out what these wires are.
My guess is that there are 7 white and 7 gray wires because the house
has 7 hardwired zones and the green wire is for the keypad and blue
wire is phone line. Can anyone tell me what these wires are? Also, I
couldn't find wires for a keypad anywhere else in the house. Does that
mean I'll have to install the keypad inside the closet next to the
panel or should I extend the cable for the keypad so it can be
installed elsewhere?

I'm considering buying a Ademco Vista-20PS with the 6270 graphic keypad
and installing it myself, hopefully it won't be that hard.

Any information would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.
Click to expand...


One more thing... If the contacts are actually installed in the windows
and door frames, are there magnets installed in the windows/doors
themselves?? You won't need to "dig" out the wires to find which ones
go to the contacts. All you need is a magnet and your multi-meter to
determine which one's which. Hold the magnet to the contact and your
ohm-meter should drop to close to "zero". Take the magnet away and
you'll read infinity (no continuity). If you need more help feel free
to email me.
 
C

Crash Gordon

Before you buy an alarm, buy a radio tracer then you can find all the wires.

Be aware that some prewire companies install contact plugs...they may look
like contacts but aren't.



| Hello,
|
| My house had the alarm 'prewire' option and most windows and doors have
| a magnetic contact in them. Also, in one of the closets near the
| entrance, there is a bunch of wires and 2 power outlets.
|
| In the closet, there are 7 white wires, 7 slight thicker gray wires and
| 1 green and 1 blue wire. I'm trying to figure out what these wires are.
| My guess is that there are 7 white and 7 gray wires because the house
| has 7 hardwired zones and the green wire is for the keypad and blue
| wire is phone line. Can anyone tell me what these wires are? Also, I
| couldn't find wires for a keypad anywhere else in the house. Does that
| mean I'll have to install the keypad inside the closet next to the
| panel or should I extend the cable for the keypad so it can be
| installed elsewhere?
|
| I'm considering buying a Ademco Vista-20PS with the 6270 graphic keypad
| and installing it myself, hopefully it won't be that hard.
|
| Any information would be greatly appreciated.
|
| Thanks.
|
|
 
M

mikey

I'll bet I'm the only one here that will admit to actually sitting a magnet
on one of those things and looking for the short.
 
C

Crash Gordon

Yah probably as bad as one of my salesguys going out to a huge house and
bidding the job based on the fact that all doors/windows had contacts. NOT !
They were all plugs. I made HIM install all the contacts while my installers
did the rest of the job. You shoulda heard the whining. But...he never did
that again!


| I'll bet I'm the only one here that will admit to actually sitting a
magnet
| on one of those things and looking for the short.
|
| | > Before you buy an alarm, buy a radio tracer then you can find all the
| wires.
| >
| > Be aware that some prewire companies install contact plugs...they may
look
| > like contacts but aren't.
| >
| >
| >
| > | > | Hello,
| > |
| > | My house had the alarm 'prewire' option and most windows and doors
have
| > | a magnetic contact in them. Also, in one of the closets near the
| > | entrance, there is a bunch of wires and 2 power outlets.
| > |
| > | In the closet, there are 7 white wires, 7 slight thicker gray wires
and
| > | 1 green and 1 blue wire. I'm trying to figure out what these wires
are.
| > | My guess is that there are 7 white and 7 gray wires because the house
| > | has 7 hardwired zones and the green wire is for the keypad and blue
| > | wire is phone line. Can anyone tell me what these wires are? Also, I
| > | couldn't find wires for a keypad anywhere else in the house. Does that
| > | mean I'll have to install the keypad inside the closet next to the
| > | panel or should I extend the cable for the keypad so it can be
| > | installed elsewhere?
| > |
| > | I'm considering buying a Ademco Vista-20PS with the 6270 graphic
keypad
| > | and installing it myself, hopefully it won't be that hard.
| > |
| > | Any information would be greatly appreciated.
| > |
| > | Thanks.
| > |
| > |
| >
| >
|
|
 
R

Robert L Bass

Yah probably as bad as one of my salesguys going out to a huge house and
bidding the job based on the fact that all doors/windows had contacts. NOT !
Click to expand...

One of my favorite sales calls was a couple in a rural town in
Connecticut. They'd scheduled an "authorized dealer" sales rep
to make his presentation several hours before me. He showed up a
little late -- understandable sine the place was somewhat out in
the boondocks. He was still there when I arrived.

I got there a few minutes early and saw his car in the driveway
so I waited a few minutes and then just walked up and rang the
bell. The other guy was miffed that I was interrupting his
pitch... er, security survey. Oh, well.

Anyway, the fun part came a few minutes into my presentation. As
I walked around the house I explained how we would protect each
window and door, where we'd place motion, glass breakage and
smoke detectors, etc. The homeowner asked if I was going to use
wireless. I said no, we prefer to hard-wire our systems. He
said that, "ADT says they can't wire this king of house because
it's a raised ranch" with a finished basement.

I had already wired plenty of similar homes so I just said,
"Maybe they can't but I've done it plenty of times. It's really
not a problem." Needless to say, I got the job. Some of these
competing salesman can be real blessing... for their competitors.
:^)

--

Regards,
Robert L Bass

Bass Burglar Alarms
The Online DIY Store
http://www.BassBurglarAlarms.com
 
C

Crash Gordon

I had a very similar sales call once...XXX guy said they'd use a wireless
system. I said why spend all that money?..the house is prewired! (I had
prewired it)...the XXX guy never even looked! No brainer that I got the job.


|> Yah probably as bad as one of my salesguys going out to a huge house and
| > bidding the job based on the fact that all doors/windows had contacts.
NOT !
|
| One of my favorite sales calls was a couple in a rural town in
| Connecticut. They'd scheduled an "authorized dealer" sales rep
| to make his presentation several hours before me. He showed up a
| little late -- understandable sine the place was somewhat out in
| the boondocks. He was still there when I arrived.
|
| I got there a few minutes early and saw his car in the driveway
| so I waited a few minutes and then just walked up and rang the
| bell. The other guy was miffed that I was interrupting his
| pitch... er, security survey. Oh, well.
|
| Anyway, the fun part came a few minutes into my presentation. As
| I walked around the house I explained how we would protect each
| window and door, where we'd place motion, glass breakage and
| smoke detectors, etc. The homeowner asked if I was going to use
| wireless. I said no, we prefer to hard-wire our systems. He
| said that, "ADT says they can't wire this king of house because
| it's a raised ranch" with a finished basement.
|
| I had already wired plenty of similar homes so I just said,
| "Maybe they can't but I've done it plenty of times. It's really
| not a problem." Needless to say, I got the job. Some of these
| competing salesman can be real blessing... for their competitors.
| :^)
|
| --
|
| Regards,
| Robert L Bass
|
| Bass Burglar Alarms
| The Online DIY Store
| http://www.BassBurglarAlarms.com
 
R

Robert L Bass

I had a very similar sales call once...XXX guy said they'd
use a wireless system. I said why spend all that money?..
the house is prewired! (I had prewired it)...the XXX guy
never even looked! No brainer that I got the job.
Click to expand...

You really have to love those guys. :^)

--

Regards,
Robert L Bass

Bass Burglar Alarms
The Online DIY Store
http://www.BassBurglarAlarms.com
 
C

Crash Gordon

For awhile there they were doing that (selling wireless) even when they knew
the house was prewired. Dunno why, maybe they figured most prewires are crap
(pot calling the kettle black).

I did a Pro 1 take over Saturday. Prewire was by someone else ( cheap
builder job) but there were spare wires in the box. I couldn't figure out
why they had sold the owner 1 x 5881L reciever and 1 x 5890 pir...when there
was an easily located wire for a wired motion detector 6 inches to the left
of where they put the 5890! DUH.

Oh yeah they also had a non-opening window in the garage wired but beanied
off in the wall...but in the loop, and described on the keypad as being in
the loop.



|> I had a very similar sales call once...XXX guy said they'd
| > use a wireless system. I said why spend all that money?..
| > the house is prewired! (I had prewired it)...the XXX guy
| > never even looked! No brainer that I got the job.
|
| You really have to love those guys. :^)
|
| --
|
| Regards,
| Robert L Bass
|
| Bass Burglar Alarms
| The Online DIY Store
| http://www.BassBurglarAlarms.com
|
 
R

Robert L Bass

For awhile there they were doing that (selling wireless)
even when they knew the house was prewired.
Click to expand...

That reminded me of my all-time favorite nutty customer story.
We pre-wired a house for a wealthy doctor and his family during
construction and came back when the house was finished to install
the hardware. It was always our policy to pull extra cables from
the garage and the attic to the alarm control panel location
which was usually in the basement.

A few months after we finished installing the system I got a call
from the lady of the house. "My alarm is 'broken'. Send someone
over here at once!"

I explained that my tech were already out on calls. Could she
wait about an hour or so for the next available person? No, she
was in a hurry. "Send someone right now!" :^)

I asked what was wrong. She said the little green light is
"broken". (For the uninitiated, that's the system ready light
which goes out if something is open. She had a Moose Z1100e with
Z1100R keypads. I asked her to push "2" for zone status, quickly
determined that one of the living room windows was open and told
her so. She insisted the windows were shut and refused to even
check. "I want someone here NOW!!"

I grabbed my tool belt, hopped in my van and drove several miles
to her home on the other side of town. Before ringing the
doorbell, I walked over to the side of the front porch in front
of the living room. Sure enough, a window was open about 2
inches.

I went inside, showed her again how to check for an open zone and
that the problem appeared to be a living room window. Then I
walked with her to the living room, drew one curtain aside and
pointed out the open window.

She said, "Well that should not prevent me from setting the
system. Can you fix it?"

I said, "Sure," closed and locked the window and then walked her
back to the keypad. She said something like, "I've never seen
such a stupid system."

I asked for a place to sit for a moment, opened my metal flip
case and wrote her a bill for the service visit. She said it was
under warranty and she was not paying for anything."

I said, "OK" and started to head for the door, making a mental
note to cancel her contract ass soon as the term was up.

Now comes the best part. Before I could get out the door, she
said that she was very disappointed that we hadn't finished the
installation. Knowing full well we had, I asked what she meant.
She had me go to the control panel in the basement. There she
pointed out three or four *extra* cables we had pulled which were
not connected to anything.

I explained that we ran extra cables at no cost to her in order
to facilitate future upgrades should the need arise. She was
incredulous. "*Nobody EVER* does more work than they're paid
for. I want you to finish this job!"

I said I'd talk to the technician (just wanting to leave at that
point). Her husband called that night and was very upset about
the same nonsense. When their year was up they received a
cancellation notice.

I figured that was the last we'd see of them. Wrong! A few
years later we bought out another small firm and guess whose
system was among the contracts.

I think if that woman was a coyote caught in a trap she'd chew
three legs off and still be stuck. :^)

--

Regards,
Robert L Bass

Bass Burglar Alarms
The Online DIY Store
http://www.BassBurglarAlarms.com
 
C

Crash Gordon

I've had a couple like that too. Easiest way is to just connect those spare
wires to anything.
I can't tellya how many windows I've gone out and closed because they're too
lazy to go check. Usually they pay, if they don't the next service call just
costs a bit more.


|> For awhile there they were doing that (selling wireless)
| > even when they knew the house was prewired.
|
| That reminded me of my all-time favorite nutty customer story.
| We pre-wired a house for a wealthy doctor and his family during
| construction and came back when the house was finished to install
| the hardware. It was always our policy to pull extra cables from
| the garage and the attic to the alarm control panel location
| which was usually in the basement.
|
| A few months after we finished installing the system I got a call
| from the lady of the house. "My alarm is 'broken'. Send someone
| over here at once!"
|
| I explained that my tech were already out on calls. Could she
| wait about an hour or so for the next available person? No, she
| was in a hurry. "Send someone right now!" :^)
|
| I asked what was wrong. She said the little green light is
| "broken". (For the uninitiated, that's the system ready light
| which goes out if something is open. She had a Moose Z1100e with
| Z1100R keypads. I asked her to push "2" for zone status, quickly
| determined that one of the living room windows was open and told
| her so. She insisted the windows were shut and refused to even
| check. "I want someone here NOW!!"
|
| I grabbed my tool belt, hopped in my van and drove several miles
| to her home on the other side of town. Before ringing the
| doorbell, I walked over to the side of the front porch in front
| of the living room. Sure enough, a window was open about 2
| inches.
|
| I went inside, showed her again how to check for an open zone and
| that the problem appeared to be a living room window. Then I
| walked with her to the living room, drew one curtain aside and
| pointed out the open window.
|
| She said, "Well that should not prevent me from setting the
| system. Can you fix it?"
|
| I said, "Sure," closed and locked the window and then walked her
| back to the keypad. She said something like, "I've never seen
| such a stupid system."
|
| I asked for a place to sit for a moment, opened my metal flip
| case and wrote her a bill for the service visit. She said it was
| under warranty and she was not paying for anything."
|
| I said, "OK" and started to head for the door, making a mental
| note to cancel her contract ass soon as the term was up.
|
| Now comes the best part. Before I could get out the door, she
| said that she was very disappointed that we hadn't finished the
| installation. Knowing full well we had, I asked what she meant.
| She had me go to the control panel in the basement. There she
| pointed out three or four *extra* cables we had pulled which were
| not connected to anything.
|
| I explained that we ran extra cables at no cost to her in order
| to facilitate future upgrades should the need arise. She was
| incredulous. "*Nobody EVER* does more work than they're paid
| for. I want you to finish this job!"
|
| I said I'd talk to the technician (just wanting to leave at that
| point). Her husband called that night and was very upset about
| the same nonsense. When their year was up they received a
| cancellation notice.
|
| I figured that was the last we'd see of them. Wrong! A few
| years later we bought out another small firm and guess whose
| system was among the contracts.
|
| I think if that woman was a coyote caught in a trap she'd chew
| three legs off and still be stuck. :^)
|
| --
|
| Regards,
| Robert L Bass
|
| Bass Burglar Alarms
| The Online DIY Store
| http://www.BassBurglarAlarms.com
|
 
B

Bob Worthy

Robert L Bass said:
One of my favorite sales calls was a couple in a rural town in
Connecticut. They'd scheduled an "authorized dealer" sales rep
to make his presentation several hours before me.
Click to expand...

I didn't realize ADT had the "authorized dealer" program way back when you
were installing in Conn.
 
B

Bob Worthy

Robert L Bass said:
That reminded me of my all-time favorite nutty customer story.
We pre-wired a house for a wealthy doctor and his family during
construction and came back when the house was finished to install
the hardware. It was always our policy to pull extra cables from
the garage and the attic to the alarm control panel location
which was usually in the basement.

A few months after we finished installing the system I got a call
from the lady of the house. "My alarm is 'broken'. Send someone
over here at once!"

I explained that my tech were already out on calls. Could she
wait about an hour or so for the next available person? No, she
was in a hurry. "Send someone right now!" :^)

I asked what was wrong. She said the little green light is
"broken". (For the uninitiated, that's the system ready light
which goes out if something is open. She had a Moose Z1100e with
Z1100R keypads. I asked her to push "2" for zone status, quickly
determined that one of the living room windows was open and told
her so. She insisted the windows were shut and refused to even
check. "I want someone here NOW!!"

I grabbed my tool belt, hopped in my van and drove several miles
to her home on the other side of town. Before ringing the
doorbell, I walked over to the side of the front porch in front
of the living room. Sure enough, a window was open about 2
inches.

I went inside, showed her again how to check for an open zone and
that the problem appeared to be a living room window. Then I
walked with her to the living room, drew one curtain aside and
pointed out the open window.

She said, "Well that should not prevent me from setting the
system. Can you fix it?"

I said, "Sure," closed and locked the window and then walked her
back to the keypad. She said something like, "I've never seen
such a stupid system."

I asked for a place to sit for a moment, opened my metal flip
case and wrote her a bill for the service visit. She said it was
under warranty and she was not paying for anything."

I said, "OK" and started to head for the door, making a mental
note to cancel her contract ass soon as the term was up.

Now comes the best part. Before I could get out the door, she
said that she was very disappointed that we hadn't finished the
installation. Knowing full well we had, I asked what she meant.
She had me go to the control panel in the basement. There she
pointed out three or four *extra* cables we had pulled which were
not connected to anything.

I explained that we ran extra cables at no cost to her in order
to facilitate future upgrades should the need arise. She was
incredulous. "*Nobody EVER* does more work than they're paid
for. I want you to finish this job!"

I said I'd talk to the technician (just wanting to leave at that
point). Her husband called that night and was very upset about
the same nonsense. When their year was up they received a
cancellation notice.

I figured that was the last we'd see of them. Wrong! A few
years later we bought out another small firm and guess whose
system was among the contracts.
Click to expand...

Nice **story** Robert, but it somehow contadicts all of your recent reasons
for bashing professional alarm companies, professional installation methods,
service response, monitoring contracts, and service fees charged by the
alarm company and the fact that there is value of contacts through
acquisitions. It sounds like you operated the same. Or is your story and
your opinions just like any other bASS when they are flip flopping on the
deck when they get caught.
 
J

JoeRaisin

I did a takeover from ADT where they had installed 6816's (transmitters
on the slab and magnet on the jamb)on doors with wired contacts in them
and even put wireless smokes on hte back boxes with the fire wire coiled
up under it.
 
M

mikey

Nice **story** Robert, but it somehow contadicts all of your recent reasons
for bashing professional alarm companies, professional installation methods,
service response, monitoring contracts, and service fees charged by the
alarm company and the fact that there is value of contacts through
acquisitions. It sounds like you operated the same. Or is your story and
your opinions just like any other bASS when they are flip flopping on the
deck when they get caught.
Click to expand...

Fishermen have big boots too. Ask him the one about him responding
as fast as the fire dept did.
 
J

Jim

Bob said:
Nice **story** Robert, but it somehow contadicts all of your recent reasons
for bashing professional alarm companies, professional installation methods,
service response, monitoring contracts, and service fees charged by the
alarm company and the fact that there is value of contacts through
acquisitions. It sounds like you operated the same. Or is your story and
your opinions just like any other bASS when they are flip flopping on the
deck when they get caught.
Click to expand...

You caught that too ..... huh?

These are the things that you just can't explain to people who come
here, get taken in by his slimey sweet talk and think that he's really
on the up and up.

I wonder if he's got Snake Oil and a bridge or two, on his web site.
 
C

Crash Gordon

I think that happens when a salesguy doesn't have a freekin clue and wants
to boost his commish.


|I did a takeover from ADT where they had installed 6816's (transmitters
| on the slab and magnet on the jamb)on doors with wired contacts in them
| and even put wireless smokes on hte back boxes with the fire wire coiled
| up under it.
|
|
| Crash Gordon wrote:
| > For awhile there they were doing that (selling wireless) even when they
knew
| > the house was prewired. Dunno why, maybe they figured most prewires are
crap
| > (pot calling the kettle black).
| >
| > I did a Pro 1 take over Saturday. Prewire was by someone else ( cheap
| > builder job) but there were spare wires in the box. I couldn't figure
out
| > why they had sold the owner 1 x 5881L reciever and 1 x 5890 pir...when
there
| > was an easily located wire for a wired motion detector 6 inches to the
left
| > of where they put the 5890! DUH.
| >
| > Oh yeah they also had a non-opening window in the garage wired but
beanied
| > off in the wall...but in the loop, and described on the keypad as being
in
| > the loop.
| >
| >
| >
| > | > |> I had a very similar sales call once...XXX guy said they'd
| > | > use a wireless system. I said why spend all that money?..
| > | > the house is prewired! (I had prewired it)...the XXX guy
| > | > never even looked! No brainer that I got the job.
| > |
| > | You really have to love those guys. :^)
| > |
| > | --
| > |
| > | Regards,
| > | Robert L Bass
| > |
| > | Bass Burglar Alarms
| > | The Online DIY Store
| > | http://www.BassBurglarAlarms.com
| > |
| >
| >
|
 
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